HeberRam

I don't want to get into brands war. I'm looking if someone has ACTUALLY dyno tested a stock air box system, to a funnel Ram Airbox, or Rapid Flow Induction system for any HP gain??? I realize some manufactures claim HP gains, higher flow rates, lower EGT's, however, does anyone have any dyno charts or other material to back those claims???<br><br>Steve ???

Got Smoke?

[quote author=HeberRam link=board=7;threadid=13870;start=0#130337 date=1050980028]<br>I don't want to get into brands war. I'm looking if someone has ACTUALLY dyno tested a stock air box system, to a funnel Ram Airbox, or Rapid Flow Induction system for any HP gain??? I realize some manufactures claim HP gains, higher flow rates, lower EGT's, however, does anyone have any dyno charts or other material to back those claims???<br><br>Steve ???<br>[/quote]<br><br>I have a Scotty II in &quot;hush mode&quot; (no cowl hole yet) and I have noticed NICE EGT reductions with it. Very well pleased with the purchase.<br><br>Upon installation I noticed 100* reduction in everyday driving, and quicker cool down times, and also getting back to &quot;safe temps&quot; after playing! <br><br>Would highly recommend a Scotty II for &quot;BOMBed&quot; CTD's.<br><br><br>P.S. Not affiliated with that penguine love'n Rod

Battering Ram

HerberRam, I don't know of any companies pushing a hp gain and I don't think any should. I went from a K&amp;N cone filter to a Scotty II w/AFE filter. I saw a solid 150 degree EGT decrease. I also had noticible quicker spoolup and boost went up 4psi. Now I do not think the spoolup and boost increase are always seen, but this is what happened on my truck. I don't have the Scotty anymore because of the twins but when I installed it on my brothers truck I saw a 100 degree drop and also an increase in boost. The only way you would see a boost increase is when your not hitting enough boost currently to open the wastegate or you have no wastegate.

Bart Timothy

Steve, try getting a hold of Joe D. He has done extensive dyno testing of the stock air box and some others. I don't know how recent his tests are, so he may not have info on some of the newer systems.<br><br>Joe has quit publishing his dyno testing results on all sorts of modifications because of the flaming he gets from others on his findings. An example is he kept running the stock box with a paper filter up into the 600 hp mark (proped open the top for dyno runs, sometimes) - many hastled him about that. Some people didn't want to know the truth, I guess. He'll share with you on a one to one basis, though.

Push Rod

Steve,<br><br>We have no dyno charts for you, and indeed we question the wisdom of anyone who dynos an air system on the 2nd Gen RAMs. There are no sensors in the air stream that influence the maps or fueling in any way, so in order to gain any HP, you'd need to be seriously starving the turbo of air, making it work so hard to pump air that it heats up the air that it is pumping. Added to this, is the fact that any air system, whether it be an open filter or a closed system needs fresh air flow to work properly, and you'll find that your dyno results will be seriously skewed.<br><br>On the EGT reduction side, we've gathered numbers from customers over the past 1.5 years, as well as our own testing. In every case, and every air system, unloaded cruise EGT reductions are minimal. As weight, extent of modifications, and throttle opening went up, EGT reductions increased.<br><br>Our results are as follows:<br><br>BHAF - Reports of anywhere between a 25F increase to 50F decrease in EGTs. Our own testing showed a 0F decrease in EGTs while at unloaded cruise, 50F at loaded cruise, and 50F at WOT. A heat shield gave another 25F reduction at loaded and WOT.<br><br>Oiled filter (type of filter doesn't seem to matter) - 0F - 50F cruise EGT reductions, up to 125F reductions at loaded cruise (weights were anywhere between 8K and 15K reported) and WOT conditions. Heat shields seemed to help a little more, with additional reductions of up to 50F.<br><br>Volant air system - Only 3 results found on this system, each showing a max EGT reduction of 200F at WOT, on fairly heavily modified trucks (HX40 class turbos, DD 3 and SM injectors, Edge Comp boxes). No reports on cruise EGT reductions, and attempts to contact the customers reporting the numbers were unsuccessful.<br><br>Scotty Air II - This is going to seem like a bit of an informercial now, however since we distribute the system, we've done alot more testing with it, and gathered many more results.<br><br>Unload cruise conditions - 50F average reduction at cruise. Numbers anywhere between 0F and 100F on trucks anywhere between stock, and relatively heavily modified (HX40, B1 class turbos, DD 3's to Mach 6 injectors, Edge DRAG Comps, TST PM3 Comps).<br><br>Loaded cruise reductions (weights between 6K and 38K) in Hush mode - 85F average reduction. Numbers between 0F and 150F on trucks between stock power levels and fairly heavily modified.<br><br>Loaded cruise reductions (same weight range) in dual inlet mode - 160F average, numbers between 50F and 250F.<br><br>WOT conditions, unloaded truck, Hush mode - 120F average. Numbers between 50F and 250F (two results, each eliminated due to error concerns, as other closest results were 200F).<br><br>WOT conditions, unloaded truck, dual inet - 220F average. Numbers between 100F and 350F (1 400F reduction run eliminated due to error concerns).<br><br>WOT conditions, loaded truck, hush mode - no numbers<br><br>WOT conditions, loaded truck, dual inlet - Only 1 result here, and this was on my own '01 Dodge, with a DRAG Comp, RV275 injectors, stock HX35 turbo. I did this before Scott and I entered into our partnership on the systems. Load weight was 15K, trailer weight 3500 lbs. Testing done in direct drive showed 1450F on the pyro with stock airbox, and throttle held open until 80 MPH. With the air system, 1150F max EGTs. In OD, pyrometer was pegged by 50 MPH, and remained pegged until 80 MPH. With the II installed, max EGTs went to 1250F and stayed until throttle was back down at 80 MPH.<br><br>In the last 4 months, we haven't had alot of new numbers gathered. To be honest, we haven't seen a need, as the reductions are real, and repeated on a variety of trucks, under a variety of circumstances. The latest test truck is an 02 that we are testing a B1B on. Fueling box is a TST PM3 Comp and injectors are DD2s. No numbers read at cruise, just WOT conditions. Stock airbox gave us a solid planting of the 1500F pyrometer. Scotty in hush mode showed a slower rise to 1500F, needle bouncing slightly on the peg. Dual inlet mode has given us max EGTs of 1300F.<br><br>For other results, a glance through the TDR and DTR archives should get you other numbers. Dee Rawson also did an excellent test measuring EGTs and IATs of the BHAF versus the Scotty II during towing, and up a grade.<br><br>I hope this is something along the lines of what you were looking for, Steve.<br><br>Rod

Push Rod

I also need to add some additonal information for 03 Cummins owners.

Testing results are minimal right now, as the air systems haven't had many miles on them, our own Ram Air 3 included. HP gains are indeed possible with an air system, however only at higher altitudes (the higher the altitude, the more likely the gain) due to the IAT/AP sensor which heavily defuels at higher altitudes. I currently suspect that these gains will completely disappear as the modification level increases. Our own testing, at 800 feet above sea level, has revealed some surprises:

Stock truck - cruise EGT reductions of 50F. WOT reductions - none. Throttle response at 60 - 80 mph was increased with the addition of the Ram Air system. We haven't had a chance to gather any voltage reading off the IAT/AP sensor, however we suspect that we've fooled it into believing its running at a lower altitude due to increased airflow, and as such, we've seen a fueling increase.

Edge EZ equipped truck - cruise EGTs of 50F. WOT throttle reductions - 150F. The wide open throttle runs have been a little surprising actually. Under load (ie: during acceleration) the EGTs would rise to about 1350F (with the stock airbox, 1400F). Once up against the speed limiter, EGTs would back down to 1150F - 1250F and hover between those marks. Stock airbox would back down to 1350F and remain there. The hovering with the Ram Air 3 is a little interesting, and I'm not really sure why we're seeing it. I suspect that the truck is defueling a hair when hitting the limiter, and when the speed backs down a bit (the speedo needle will move a bit, about 1 needle width) the fuel comes back, hence the needle hunting.

Rod

Scotty

[quote author=Ascraeus link=board=7;threadid=13870;start=0#130493 date=1051027419]<br>Hey, Push Rod, have you got any numbers on how much flow there is through the four-inch outlet at the end of the AFE/K&amp;N/BHAF filters. A Fleetguard engineer told me that when you get into high flow oiled filters or polymer filters with large surfaces like the BHAF, the outlet determines the amount of air entering the turbo. In other words, the outlet is more restrictive than the element on the hi-performance filters. <br><br>ascraeus<br>[/quote]<br><br>Taking this a step further I believe that the smallest internal diameter of the turbo itself would be more of a restriction then the hose from filter to turbo.<br>Why not try it out for yourself and share the knowledge? The air always gets squished down to smaller spots that might be harder to address...you know the story...&quot;your only as strong as the weakest link&quot;.

Scotty

[quote author=Bart Timothy link=board=7;threadid=13870;start=0#130386 date=1050987608]<br>Steve, try getting a hold of Joe D. He has done extensive dyno testing of the stock air box and some others. I don't know how recent his tests are, so he may not have info on some of the newer systems.<br><br>Joe has quit publishing his dyno testing results on all sorts of modifications because of the flaming he gets from others on his findings. An example is he kept running the stock box with a paper filter up into the 600 hp mark (proped open the top for dyno runs, sometimes) - many hastled him about that. Some people didn't want to know the truth, I guess. He'll share with you on a one to one basis, though.<br>[/quote]<br><br>Dyno testing a system that needs the air flow of a truck rolling down the road in the real world should net better results then the dyno tests. A static test like that might show 7Hp gain with a certain application. However, I have seen a variance of a lot more then that on dyno runs simply from operator error or differences and or driver response on the dyno. <br>Perhaps this is why Joe D did not test the Scotty in his detailed in depth article?

crabman

Having no expertise in this matter I cant add but one thing. When I threw BDs Xintake on the truck it became more responsive ie revs up to where it starts pulling quicker. Even my wife noticed the difference. Im guessing you would see the same with any of the other intake setups or perhaps even just swapping the element. To my mind that makes it worth the trip so to speak at least for us 03 guys.

StakeMan

Has anyone ever seen that 600 hp graph?

Don M

[quote author=StakeMan link=board=7;threadid=13870;start=0#130518 date=1051031077]<br>Has anyone ever seen that 600 hp graph?<br>[/quote]<br><br>Yes<br><br>Don~

misterKTM

Hey crabman, What is the BD Xintake ? I just looked on there website and didn't see anything.

misterKTM

OK, Finally found it on their web site..no pictures of the '03, can you post any crabman ? What are your thoughts of it ? The scotty system seems pretty popular, what made you go with the BD ? <br><br>Thanks,<br><br>Rob<br>

DEZLPWR

All I have to say is:<br><br>SCOTTY, YOU ARE DA MAN!!!!!!!! ;D ;D ;D<br><br>I installed my Scotty II @ the WADTR #10 bomb party this weekend, and all I have to say is !<br><br>My PDR 40 now sounds like a 747 spooling up for takeoff, and EGT's @ WOT are down 200+*. I must admit, I was skeptical of the claims, but not now.... It works! 8) <br><br>****Not affiliated with any vendor, just happy with my bombs!****