HOHN

OF course 1000HP is possible. Will it be done? Well, I personally would like to see just how strong the stock bottom end in a CTD is. I have heard of failures in the high hp trucks, but those are usually head gaskets. I can't recall hearing of piston, crank, or rod failure. Not to say it hasn't happened.<br><br>The stock bottom end in a CTD is very beefy. Too beefy for performance (high HP) use. It is designed for durability above all else. It's TOO heavy for higher RPM. Rumor has it that the 5.9B will start coming apart at 4300 rpm.<br><br>I would bet that some custom Oliver-style parabolic connecting rods would save a lot of weight. Also, for higher RPM the CTD need to have longer rods and shorter pistons. The tall stock pistons are durable and stable, but too heavy and have too much friction at higher RPM. Swapping compression height for connecting rod length will also increase the rod ratio and help higher RPM performance.<br><br>Also, the compression is too high for serious performance use. It needs to be dropped to 15.5 or even lower, if you can get the engine to start with that. The lower the better for a turbo diesel. It's more productive to run higher boost as opposed to higher compression. It's all about VOLUME, not PRESSURE.<br><br>With a custom bottom end as described above, PLUS an ultralightweight Bryant or Winberg crank, the bottom would be set to handle higher rpm.<br><br>The other problem is fuel delivery. The VP44 can't turn much over 4K engine rpm (2K pump rpm). I dunno about the 7100, but it too has to have it's limit.<br><br>The other HUGE problem is that diesel fuel just burns too slowly to be used effectively at higher RPM. IF you rev it high enough, the fuel won't have time to burn, and the exiting exhaust will still be on fire! This will produce torch-hot EGTs, and soon, meltdown.<br><br>All this is predicated on the truth of what Gary said: the big HP numbers will come when higher RPM is achieved. Achieving that higher RPM is going to be VERY difficult, because you are starting to get up against the laws of physics and how fast you can burn diesel.<br><br>Now if you could come up with a direct-injection, compression ignition, pilot injected GASOLINE engine, you would have SERIOUS power potential, espcially at higher rpm.<br><br>Of course, I wonder why there aren't standard hot-rod parts like rollerized cams and valvetrain parts being made yet. What about thermal barrier coatings on pistons, chambers, and ex ports?<br><br>The mind DOES wander, doesn't it?<br><br>HOHN

StakeMan

Just a thought to throw into the pot.<br><br>Consider that the P-pump was designed to operate efficently at a certain rpm range and it is currently the pump to go with if you want peak HP. The VP-44 has a wider power band at the cost of max peak HP or fuel flow. What would happen if you narrowed the power band of the VP-44? Would it now have the same abillity as the p7100 to produce such peak HP numbers.<br><br>Thats why I think the VP44 will be the king of 1/4 mile until the common rail comes of age.<br><br>I like the way this thread is going. Maybe we can learn something from this.

TxDieselKid

[quote author=HOHN link=board=7;threadid=14668;start=15#138085 date=1052933464]<br><br>Of course, I wonder why there aren't standard hot-rod parts like rollerized cams and valvetrain parts being made yet. What about thermal barrier coatings on pistons, chambers, and ex ports?<br><br>The mind DOES wander, doesn't it?<br><br>HOHN<br>[/quote]<br><br>I have heard of a custom FULL billet head for out 5.9's. I have also heard of billet cams.<br><br>Bench racing is the funnest sometimes. <br><br>Andrew

Idaho CTD

The biggest problem with the vp-44 is the amount of fuel it will flow. I personally think the 24v trucks have a greater potential for hp but many or most dont agree with me ;D. Look at the hp numbers produced by a 24v truck with, in most cases, less than half the potential fuel flow of a 12v. We are seeing close the the limit of the vp's flow capabilities now but I dont think a 12v truck is going to produce 2x the hp of a 24v. Also look at the smoke produced by a 12v for the same hp as a 24v. Looks like inefficientcy to me.<br><br>IMO the only reason such high rpms might be needed to reach 1000hp is to push huge turbos to force enough air into the cylinders. Not many have looked extensively at the intake and exhaust manifolds as ways to improve the flow into and out of the head either.<br><br>I think the common rail system might be the way to go for super high hp. The reason being is the ability to control each injector and give more than one shot of fuel per cycle. Look at the hp they produce now for how little the egt's and smoke. The new heads also flow more than any others out there in stock form.<br><br>Just my opinion but who am I<br>Remember it wasn't too long ago that 400hp was considered impossible <br>Nathan

StakeMan

Idaho CTD,

I think the VP44 could flow nearly as much as a tweaked (not a stupid) pump with the right modifications.

Helicopter Dan

swaps in alot of the different events are not allowed has to be a the stock engine the truck came with it can be modified hence cams headwork twins etc Gary you ever get the chance fly or drive to muncie or shieds for the events there the video's can not portray the power those guys put out.seeing it in person is the only way you can fathom the power these guys build into their trucks you won't question that 1000hp is easly obtainable after seeing them in action. there's alot of things goiing on out there the only thing is alot of the high hp guys arn't computer people also they use the 12v

Jim Fulmer

I think the VP44 could flow nearly as much as a tweaked (not a stupid) pump with the right modifications. <br><br>Not mine! Definately not at this date

1dslram

Triple tubos are in the works so air will not be a problem, the fuel is available shall I say Stupid Pump or? Yes 1,000 HP will happen and more that likely happen by early next year.<br>Bruce

HOHN

[quote author=Idaho CTD link=board=7;threadid=14668;start=15#138154 date=1052945132]<br>I think the common rail system might be the way to go for super high hp. The reason being is the ability to control each injector and give more than one shot of fuel per cycle. Look at the hp they produce now for how little the egt's and smoke. The new heads also flow more than any others out there in stock form....Remember it wasn't too long ago that 400hp was considered impossible <br>Nathan<br>[/quote]<br><br>VERY TRUE!! I suspect that when the HUGE HP numbers start cumming in (ha) that the common rail motors will rule the roost. Remember, the VP44 was just a stopgap en route to the common rail engines. The common rail will be the king of fueling. I suspect that we are not far from the common rail putting our enough fuel to make Piers Stupid pump look like it's spitting through a caffee stirrer. The common rail has the WHOLE RAIL pressurized! That means that the pump does NOT limit fueling in any way. All you have to do to get more fuel in a common rail engine is hold open the injectors longer and/or make them flow more.<br><br>Are the common rail's injectors electric or cam-operated? If they are electric, then SERIOUS HP is just a box away! Cam, is a little more involved.<br><br>The superior airflow of the 24V design PLUS the almost unlimited fueling of the common rail design is THE recipe of the big numbers. I would suspect that a highly developed Common Rail engine with triples and enhanced head sealing could hit 1200HP (and about 1800lb-ft)<br><br>You could build a VERy hairy, yet streetable 3rd gen with just some EDM 4s and a (yet-to-be-developed) fueling box.<br><br>HOHN

Floor It

I believe 1000hp is about a year away and higher rpm will not be needed. I do think it will need different rods and pistons and rings to put the package together.The key is properly mixed amounts of fuel and air, ALOT! of it. The only problem with common rail is the pump flow not pressure.<br><br> John

Jim Fulmer

That means that the pump does NOT limit fueling in any way. All you have to do to get more fuel in a common rail engine is hold open the injectors longer and/or make them flow more.<br><br>I have to agree here, once they get the common rail system down like they do for FAST(felpro) or MOTEC systems for the gasser motors it will be a different world. <br><br>Jim

Floor It

Even with the gasser motors, they have to have a pump to keep up with the dwell of the injector pulse width or there wont be enough fuel to be injected.<br><br> John