Head Gasket and Head Stud options
01-10-2008, 05:56 AM
#31
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ohio
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
[QUOTE=dieselman2300;1881355]Funny thing about the A1s is ALOT of people think ARP and A1 is the same company. Arp has the same heavy duty studs they are the 265k series.
IMHO, those studs are overkill for you truck. They are designed for pulling/high horsepower trucks boosting in excess of 80psi. A1 and ARPs standard 12mm stud is good for 80 psi of boost.
Either you didnt properly intall the first gasket or you head/block wasnt true. Most HG failures are from improper prep of the block and head. You also need to do 3 retorques. I personally will retorque my studs until I see no more movement it the nut.
Now, I am sure youll get mad at this post, BUT people have been using the standard 12mm studs for a long time and havent had a problem. There are guys who have run 90-100psi on the standard 12mm studs BEFORE the xtra heavy duty studs even came out.
[/QUOTE
This statement is all true but my block was decked my head was flattened within .0002" (human hair is .003"), and the head was re-torqued at least three times. All of the work that was done on the block and the head was done at a shop that all they do is build high HP diesel motors and the have won the OSTPA pulls for five years running in two classes. So this wasn't their first rodeo at putting a head on a motor, since I've had mine done they have built four more motors three w/ A1's H11 tool steel studs and one w/ ARP Alloy steel studs and the ARP head has failed. Maybe these are isolated cases in our area or maybe we got a bad batch of studs I do not know. I think that you right that A1 studs are over kill but I not sure how having a little extra peace of mind on a head is a bad thing.
IMHO, those studs are overkill for you truck. They are designed for pulling/high horsepower trucks boosting in excess of 80psi. A1 and ARPs standard 12mm stud is good for 80 psi of boost.
Either you didnt properly intall the first gasket or you head/block wasnt true. Most HG failures are from improper prep of the block and head. You also need to do 3 retorques. I personally will retorque my studs until I see no more movement it the nut.
Now, I am sure youll get mad at this post, BUT people have been using the standard 12mm studs for a long time and havent had a problem. There are guys who have run 90-100psi on the standard 12mm studs BEFORE the xtra heavy duty studs even came out.
[/QUOTEThis statement is all true but my block was decked my head was flattened within .0002" (human hair is .003"), and the head was re-torqued at least three times. All of the work that was done on the block and the head was done at a shop that all they do is build high HP diesel motors and the have won the OSTPA pulls for five years running in two classes. So this wasn't their first rodeo at putting a head on a motor, since I've had mine done they have built four more motors three w/ A1's H11 tool steel studs and one w/ ARP Alloy steel studs and the ARP head has failed. Maybe these are isolated cases in our area or maybe we got a bad batch of studs I do not know. I think that you right that A1 studs are over kill but I not sure how having a little extra peace of mind on a head is a bad thing.
01-10-2008, 07:33 AM
#32
Registered User
[QUOTE=farmboy3510;1882594]
Maybe you guys should find a different machine shop. I would.
Funny thing about the A1s is ALOT of people think ARP and A1 is the same company. Arp has the same heavy duty studs they are the 265k series.
IMHO, those studs are overkill for you truck. They are designed for pulling/high horsepower trucks boosting in excess of 80psi. A1 and ARPs standard 12mm stud is good for 80 psi of boost.
Either you didnt properly intall the first gasket or you head/block wasnt true. Most HG failures are from improper prep of the block and head. You also need to do 3 retorques. I personally will retorque my studs until I see no more movement it the nut.
Now, I am sure youll get mad at this post, BUT people have been using the standard 12mm studs for a long time and havent had a problem. There are guys who have run 90-100psi on the standard 12mm studs BEFORE the xtra heavy duty studs even came out.[/QUOTE
This statement is all true but my block was decked my head was flattened within .0002" (human hair is .003"), and the head was re-torqued at least three times. All of the work that was done on the block and the head was done at a shop that all they do is build high HP diesel motors and the have won the OSTPA pulls for five years running in two classes. So this wasn't their first rodeo at putting a head on a motor, since I've had mine done they have built four more motors three w/ A1's H11 tool steel studs and one w/ ARP Alloy steel studs and the ARP head has failed. Maybe these are isolated cases in our area or maybe we got a bad batch of studs I do not know. I think that you right that A1 studs are over kill but I not sure how having a little extra peace of mind on a head is a bad thing.
IMHO, those studs are overkill for you truck. They are designed for pulling/high horsepower trucks boosting in excess of 80psi. A1 and ARPs standard 12mm stud is good for 80 psi of boost.
Either you didnt properly intall the first gasket or you head/block wasnt true. Most HG failures are from improper prep of the block and head. You also need to do 3 retorques. I personally will retorque my studs until I see no more movement it the nut.
Now, I am sure youll get mad at this post, BUT people have been using the standard 12mm studs for a long time and havent had a problem. There are guys who have run 90-100psi on the standard 12mm studs BEFORE the xtra heavy duty studs even came out.
[/QUOTEThis statement is all true but my block was decked my head was flattened within .0002" (human hair is .003"), and the head was re-torqued at least three times. All of the work that was done on the block and the head was done at a shop that all they do is build high HP diesel motors and the have won the OSTPA pulls for five years running in two classes. So this wasn't their first rodeo at putting a head on a motor, since I've had mine done they have built four more motors three w/ A1's H11 tool steel studs and one w/ ARP Alloy steel studs and the ARP head has failed. Maybe these are isolated cases in our area or maybe we got a bad batch of studs I do not know. I think that you right that A1 studs are over kill but I not sure how having a little extra peace of mind on a head is a bad thing.
Maybe you guys should find a different machine shop. I would.
01-10-2008, 09:17 AM
#33
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ohio
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That sounds like a great plan, please send me all of the info on better machine shop and I will give them a call and send my truck there have them redo everything. There is nothing worse than than "having a bunch of overpriced stuff" on my truck and not being worth it. I forwarded the info to my machine shop and let them know the problem w/ their work, they will be getting in contact w/ you to find out how to do things, and where to purchase all of their parts and pieces from. Thanks for the help.
01-10-2008, 11:48 AM
#34
Registered User
That sounds like a great plan, please send me all of the info on better machine shop and I will give them a call and send my truck there have them redo everything. There is nothing worse than than "having a bunch of overpriced stuff" on my truck and not being worth it. I forwarded the info to my machine shop and let them know the problem w/ their work, they will be getting in contact w/ you to find out how to do things, and where to purchase all of their parts and pieces from. Thanks for the help.
I bought my BRAND NEW stage 2 ported and polished, 5 angle valve job, backcut valves, 60# valvesprings, orings,.020 Cummins gasket and 3pc. High Tech Turbo manifold through PURE DIESEL POWER. Garrett (owner of PDP) is a stand up guy and doest charge people for stuff they dont need, unless you insist.
If I would have known how good of a guy he was, I would have bought my High Tech Turbo 62/14, DDP4s, Run of the Mill 12mm ARP studs (that numerous people on here have and have been holding more boost than both of us have) South Bend Clutch 3250 Dual Disc, Rebuilt Blumenthals NV4500 with 1 3/8" billet shaft, Fluidamper, PacBrake PRXB, 4" Silverline 304 Stainless Steel TurboBack exhaust, Powertrax NO-Slip locker, and I'm sure theres a bunch of stuff I'm forgeting.
Oh yeah I almost forgot about the S400 thats sitting in the box by my front door for the twins project this winter.
I also just sold my Coolingmist stage2 diesel water/methanol kit, because I shouldnt need it anymore because of that MONSTER turbo that I just bought.
NOW, you see why my sig. is like that, you can have only so many words in it.
I also attached some pics of the S400, incase you would care to look at this monster.
Have a nice day
Oh yeah make sure you have them contact me for some pointers.
01-12-2008, 04:08 PM
#35
Registered User
Here you go farmboy3510. This is a great read. Give this to your machine shop. BTW comp461 is a VERY big guy in the diesel industry. Let me know if you figure out who he is.
http://www.competitiondiesel.com/for...ad.php?t=21137
http://www.competitiondiesel.com/for...ad.php?t=21137
01-12-2008, 04:31 PM
#36
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Cummins Technical Center, IN
Posts: 6,564
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes
on
5 Posts
I A1 technology's h11 studs in my truck and have had no problem. I did have arp studs and they did not last over 30 lbs of boost. I put 3k miles on and they let loose I used moly coat on the threads and torqued to 120lbs cold brought up to temp and cooled and re-torqued. When head blew checked all of the studs and not two were the same. Put A1's in and torqued them cold to 115 lbs, brought it up to temp and re-torqued them to 140lbs. Then I drove it for a week real easy and then re-torqued hot again to 140lbs still got some movement and not had a bit of problems since.
A better choice than H11 is the Custom Age 625 studs that DDP, among others, has available.
JMO
01-12-2008, 04:40 PM
#37
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Cummins Technical Center, IN
Posts: 6,564
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes
on
5 Posts
Here you go farmboy3510. This is a great read. Give this to your machine shop. BTW comp461 is a VERY big guy in the diesel industry. Let me know if you figure out who he is.
http://www.competitiondiesel.com/for...ad.php?t=21137
http://www.competitiondiesel.com/for...ad.php?t=21137
JMO
01-12-2008, 07:25 PM
#38
Registered User
BTW comp461 is a VERY big guy in the diesel industry.
http://www.competitiondiesel.com/for...ad.php?t=21137
http://www.competitiondiesel.com/for...ad.php?t=21137
Just ask some of the NC guys, they can tell you all about that one.
01-12-2008, 10:03 PM
#39
Registered User
Hohn,
I was waiting to see if farmboy could tell. But oh well no big deal.
McMopar,
Gregs been doing this for awhile. And besides hes gotten better since he doesnt work for you know who. Sometimes he has good info.
I was waiting to see if farmboy could tell. But oh well no big deal.
McMopar,
Gregs been doing this for awhile. And besides hes gotten better since he doesnt work for you know who. Sometimes he has good info.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
ccb9955
3rd Gen High Performance and Accessories (5.9L Only)
11
06-07-2010 08:42 AM
Jvenne86
Performance and Accessories 2nd gen only
19
08-05-2007 11:41 PM