FASS install & pressure???'s
10-24-2006, 11:16 AM
#16
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Randi, Nice thread, good read! Welcome to the DTR!
Unanswered question is... does the Fuel Filter Canister restrict flow with the filter removed? Anyone?
RJ
Unanswered question is... does the Fuel Filter Canister restrict flow with the filter removed? Anyone?
RJ
10-24-2006, 11:31 AM
#17
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rjohnson
Thanks for the nice welcome! Been lurking here and several other forums for quite some time doing extensive reading and research.
My feeling is the fuel filter housing in and of itself would most likely not cause much, if any restriction. It's certainly the banjo fittings going into it, out of it and into the VP44 that are the biggest problem.
I've been working with diesels for quite some time, having worked in our school district as an ASE certified diesel/school bus mechanic for a good number of the 24 years spent there, tho now I just oversee the operations as Transportation Director. We have had several BlueBird TC2000's with P7100 equipped B5.9's. Loved the engines but not in those heavy buses, as at 190hp they were far under powered for the application. The majority of our buses are International's with DT466E's. Our future purchase for the coming year looks to be 3 Freightliner/Thomas C2's with the Mercedes diesel at 210hp equipped with exhaust brakes.
Waited it seems like an eternity to finally get a Dodge/Cummins truck. Couldn't justify $35,000+ on a new one over the years. This mint and meticulously maintained 98.5 I found was stumbled upon...and at $12.5k thought it was a prime deal with just 100K on the clock. My oldest son has had me wanting for some time, as he has been running a 1991 2500 twd for a couple years, purchased for $2700 and getting consistent 20mpg+.
On my first tank of fuel without mods, I averaged 17MPG hand calculated. With the mods and adding the Frantz bypass, Purolater Pure One and a fill of Shell Rotella T 5W40 synthetic, am evaluating a couple tanks of fuel to see if I've gained at all.
Randi
Thanks for the nice welcome! Been lurking here and several other forums for quite some time doing extensive reading and research.
My feeling is the fuel filter housing in and of itself would most likely not cause much, if any restriction. It's certainly the banjo fittings going into it, out of it and into the VP44 that are the biggest problem.
I've been working with diesels for quite some time, having worked in our school district as an ASE certified diesel/school bus mechanic for a good number of the 24 years spent there, tho now I just oversee the operations as Transportation Director. We have had several BlueBird TC2000's with P7100 equipped B5.9's. Loved the engines but not in those heavy buses, as at 190hp they were far under powered for the application. The majority of our buses are International's with DT466E's. Our future purchase for the coming year looks to be 3 Freightliner/Thomas C2's with the Mercedes diesel at 210hp equipped with exhaust brakes.
Waited it seems like an eternity to finally get a Dodge/Cummins truck. Couldn't justify $35,000+ on a new one over the years. This mint and meticulously maintained 98.5 I found was stumbled upon...and at $12.5k thought it was a prime deal with just 100K on the clock. My oldest son has had me wanting for some time, as he has been running a 1991 2500 twd for a couple years, purchased for $2700 and getting consistent 20mpg+.
On my first tank of fuel without mods, I averaged 17MPG hand calculated. With the mods and adding the Frantz bypass, Purolater Pure One and a fill of Shell Rotella T 5W40 synthetic, am evaluating a couple tanks of fuel to see if I've gained at all.
Randi
10-24-2006, 11:53 AM
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You can run through the filter head......we don’t recommend it due to the pressure drops you are having......Hence why the HPFP's are just a touch higher in pressure....AND we offer a BBRK (Banjo Bolt Replacement kit) for all Dodge trucks from the filter head to the Injection pump. Pressure drops (In most cases) are caused by restriction. Either on the suction side or on the pressure side before where the gauge is tapped. A faulty gauge or sending units are also very common problems.
With the pressures you are getting at idle, i don’t see the FASS being the issues here. This is why I am trying to get you to try some other things to eliminate everything but the FASS. You pressure drop is quit big for a VP-44 truck….but you still have some untested areas that could be the cause of this issue as well.
ALSO, in the winter, you don’t need your stock fuel heater if you use winter fuel (like you have a choice) and additives to keep the fuel from gelling. (AND it only works with the heater grid anyway IIRC?? Thought i read that somewhere) If you do this you should be fine. (we have had several people running the FASS with no additives at or just below 0* F with no issue...but you know your climate and additives are a safe bet.) Now for some one that lives in the Artic Circle.....this may be a different story. Last time i checked, VA didn’t get down to -40* on a regular basis?
10-24-2006, 04:45 PM
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Hi Guys
First post but thought a good place for me to chime in
I just installed a FASS 150/95 system on my newly bought, cherry 98 24 Valve CTD 3500 dually about 4 weeks ago, along with a Juice w/ Attitude. Similar install to Dusty's. I refused to wait to have issues with the LP and subsequently the VP44.
The first point to make is it's really important to eliminate all the fuel line restrictions that are present, especially from the stock fuel filter to the VP44. I removed both the stock LP and fuel filter,which also leaves many benefits to accessing the left side of the motor ie: the MAP and AIT sensors for periodic cleaning, amongst other things
I ran the 3/8" FASS fuel line directly to the VP44 as intended.
In dealing with the fuel pressure sender issue, I mounted the Edge FP sender to the FASS at the included port on the housing. Before plugging in the Juice module, I cut the fuel pressure sending plug off the Juice wiring harness about 6" back. It's a three wire harness which I extended approximately 8' with 18 guage wire, hard soldered and shrink tubed each connection and placed it in a plastic loom for protection.
I have an AFE Stage 1 Proguard 7 also installed, the Juice set for now at 1X3(don't want to take out the trans anytime soon) and a custom 3 1/2" exhaust feeding a Flowmaster into dual tailpipes. Under any acceleration scenario I've put this truck thru from mild to wild, the fuel pressure has not wavered from 16lbs at all. WOT, etc. I've been completely satisfied with it's consistency and performance. It's pricey and not for everyones budget, but if you can afford it I'd recommend it as a very good long term investment in your 24 valve, VP44 equipped truck.
Randi
addendum: I can't hear mine running either, it's pretty quiet. No power issues either.
First post but thought a good place for me to chime in
I just installed a FASS 150/95 system on my newly bought, cherry 98 24 Valve CTD 3500 dually about 4 weeks ago, along with a Juice w/ Attitude. Similar install to Dusty's. I refused to wait to have issues with the LP and subsequently the VP44.
The first point to make is it's really important to eliminate all the fuel line restrictions that are present, especially from the stock fuel filter to the VP44. I removed both the stock LP and fuel filter,which also leaves many benefits to accessing the left side of the motor ie: the MAP and AIT sensors for periodic cleaning, amongst other things
I ran the 3/8" FASS fuel line directly to the VP44 as intended.
In dealing with the fuel pressure sender issue, I mounted the Edge FP sender to the FASS at the included port on the housing. Before plugging in the Juice module, I cut the fuel pressure sending plug off the Juice wiring harness about 6" back. It's a three wire harness which I extended approximately 8' with 18 guage wire, hard soldered and shrink tubed each connection and placed it in a plastic loom for protection.
I have an AFE Stage 1 Proguard 7 also installed, the Juice set for now at 1X3(don't want to take out the trans anytime soon
) and a custom 3 1/2" exhaust feeding a Flowmaster into dual tailpipes. Under any acceleration scenario I've put this truck thru from mild to wild, the fuel pressure has not wavered from 16lbs at all. WOT, etc. I've been completely satisfied with it's consistency and performance. It's pricey and not for everyones budget, but if you can afford it I'd recommend it as a very good long term investment in your 24 valve, VP44 equipped truck.Randi
addendum: I can't hear mine running either, it's pretty quiet. No power issues either.
Good points, I wonder however about using the port on the Fass, I understand why you did and I belive it's a good idea but I have to wonder how much pressure you have at the VP. Would be a good test to see what kind of restriction the 3/8 line has over that 8 or so feet.
Welcome to the board BTW.
dan
10-24-2006, 06:17 PM
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Dan
Thanks for the kind words
You make a good point that either another end-user or Diesel-Dan may be able to answer accurately.
Although this was my first post here, I am no stranger to message board posting. Before turning my interests to all things Dodge and Cummins over the last months, I have been into all things high performance in computers. Yes, that right, including competition in 3D benching, overclocking.....being involved in the pioneer phase of supercooling CPU's to attain, with voltage mods some formidable overclocks. We started with watercooling, chilled watercooling and then I worked as a beta tester for a company in Denmark in helping develop affordable phase-change cooling for CPU's. In laymans terms, phase-change is refrigeration cooling, directly, of the computers CPU to -40c or much less. The colder you get em, the faster they'll run with additional voltage.
In that realm, I served XtremeSystems.org and XtremeResources.com as a board Moderator, Super Mod and Administrator. I also served as Senior Review+News Editor on the front page, also doing product reviews of the latest and greatest.
My current paid contracted gig, tho I've been on sabbatical since my Dads death in March, is as motherboard review writer for the largest computer hardware review site in the world, Anandtech.com.
So if there is anything I can ever help out with around here my friends, I'd be more than happy
Randi
Thanks for the kind words
You make a good point that either another end-user or Diesel-Dan may be able to answer accurately.
Although this was my first post here, I am no stranger to message board posting. Before turning my interests to all things Dodge and Cummins over the last months, I have been into all things high performance in computers. Yes, that right, including competition in 3D benching, overclocking.....being involved in the pioneer phase of supercooling CPU's to attain, with voltage mods some formidable overclocks. We started with watercooling, chilled watercooling and then I worked as a beta tester for a company in Denmark in helping develop affordable phase-change cooling for CPU's. In laymans terms, phase-change is refrigeration cooling, directly, of the computers CPU to -40c or much less. The colder you get em, the faster they'll run with additional voltage.
In that realm, I served XtremeSystems.org and XtremeResources.com as a board Moderator, Super Mod and Administrator. I also served as Senior Review+News Editor on the front page, also doing product reviews of the latest and greatest.
My current paid contracted gig, tho I've been on sabbatical since my Dads death in March, is as motherboard review writer for the largest computer hardware review site in the world, Anandtech.com.
So if there is anything I can ever help out with around here my friends, I'd be more than happy
Randi
10-24-2006, 09:52 PM
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I also thought about running my FP sender mounted at the FASS like RSica spoke of, but I thought it better to measure the pressure right at the pump, rather than at the FASS, just in case something were to happen with the line between the FASS & the VP one could catch it before toasting the pump???? I may try doing that until I can get a 90* fitting with the 1/8" hole for the FP sender in it, Dan do you guys have those fittings???? if so could you PM me with a part # and/or price please. if not could I get a 90* fitting locally & just drill & tap one side????? thanks alot for all the input guys & as soon as I get the line moved I'll update you all with the (hopefully new & improved LOL!!) pressure #'s, thanks again, & Dan please let me know about the fitting(s). Dusty
10-24-2006, 10:40 PM
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I also thought about running my FP sender mounted at the FASS like RSica spoke of, but I thought it better to measure the pressure right at the pump, rather than at the FASS, just in case something were to happen with the line between the FASS & the VP one could catch it before toasting the pump???? I may try doing that until I can get a 90* fitting with the 1/8" hole for the FP sender in it, Dan do you guys have those fittings???? if so could you PM me with a part # and/or price please. if not could I get a 90* fitting locally & just drill & tap one side????? thanks alot for all the input guys & as soon as I get the line moved I'll update you all with the (hopefully new & improved LOL!!) pressure #'s, thanks again, & Dan please let me know about the fitting(s). Dusty
.....fit and finish before SEMA.......and some how Brad found a way to PERMANITLY remove his left hand thumb nail on a grinder tonight.....wasn’t pretty.....I’m not kidding…..all you could see was bone from what I heard!!!
So im flying solo on the truck as he is currently get fixed up at the hospital.ANYWHO......we don’t stock those fittings....I would try to contact Eric over at Vulcan and see what he has in his bin of parts. OR like you said...you can get your own and drill and tap the fitting.
10-25-2006, 09:30 AM
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He is fine....but his thumb is not! I was the lucky person last night to find his thumb nail on the ground under the bench grinder..... ......BUT he is up and running around this morn with a bunch of pain killers at his side!
......BUT he is up and running around this morn with a bunch of pain killers at his side!
10-25-2006, 09:39 AM
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Glad he is up and around, could have been much worse I'm sure.
dan
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