FYI, in my prep fo the compounds I have, I have been acquiring a drive pressure, charge air temp, and a few more boost gauges. Put the drive pressure gauge on yesterday, as well as a manifold tapped Intake air temp gauge. With the stock 35, though ported to all 6, ratios were 1:1 until 40 psi, then they went lopsided. I usually don't run 40....I'm set at 35, but I wanted to see what happened. So at 40 psi (at the manifold) drive pressure was 50 psi. It's cool here right now....~30*, so IAT's weren't real dependable, but inlet temps at 10 psi were 32* and manifold temps were 34*...a little cold wouldn't you say . So then I firewalled the turbo and at 40 psi manifold pressure, inlet temps again were 32*, and manifold temps rose to 37*.....not at all what i expected to see with a turbo that is overspeeding and out of it's efficiency map. We'll see what it does if we get a warmer day.....just thought I'd share the info with you all.

On another note.....turbine housings. I almost went to a 14 and an external wastegate. Being the experimenter I am, I decided to see what I could do with the 12 I already have. I managed to get a 40mm wastegate hole out of the little 3/4" stock hole, and with a new wategate lever, have come up with an internally wastegated 40mm 12 cm housing using the stock actualtor location. To top this off, we (me and Northslope) have combined efforts and he is porting the inlet down to the gate and removing the devider just past the wastegate as well. Once this is done, my "version" of the downpipe (actually its the stage pipe) will be made to allow the 'gated exhaust an unhindered flow to the primary without colliding with the turbine exit of the secondary. When we get it all done we'll post images. I will install it prior to the compounds so I can compare numbers against the more or less stock housing.

 

You really are having to much fun with this aren't ya? Great info. Keep it comin.

 

my wife doesn't think so.......had to buy her another project car to keep her quiet. Ahh, the price of building vehicles.

 

Had to buy the wife a project car? Sounds like a great wife.

 

i'm getting a little confused here. what's the difference between the manifold temp and the IAT? i just put a two channel IAT in. with ambient around 25*, the highest i saw (about 20-25psi, the roads were really slick) AFTER the IC were 32*. now, BEFORE the IC was a whole different deal. 350*!!! and that's at half boost. cruising, the post doesn't even register on the guage, and pre is about 100*. that's at about 5-8psi. so i guess you're right around there, huh? have fun with your project.

dave

 

My experience with IAT measured at the air horn is that it is very rarely 20°F above the outside temp. I've seen IATs below 0°F(bottom of my gauge) before.
To get my IAT into the optimum range of 50°-90°F during the cold months I move the modified intake hose to my stock airbox that normally goes though the firewall to next to the turbo to suck up warmer air.

 

bump


IAT, manifold temp...I was using both terms loosely, but in the same context. My makeshift IAT is my Fluke with a fast acting t-couple slipped in the boot between the IC outlet pipe and intake horn. I am looking at a 4 channel IAT that has software for data logging into a laptop. Also building a mass sensor that will interface the same way. I want to be able to test several points, so a multi channel is what I'm after. The time is worth spending on the air characteristics IMHO because it is the heart and soul of tuning these things. Fuel is easy, but getting the air quality and quantity right are harder. I want to be able to tune for the maximum of my parts combinations. I use the same mentality with my truck as I do when tuning late model imports for all out power. Of course, being mecahnical engines poses its hurdles for data gathering, but there are some areas it can be utilized.

And yes, my wife at heart is a good sport, she just knows how to leverage her projects against mine...haha. They cost the same, but mine cost more at a whack than hers do.

And Bill, I too would like to see some higher temps, and I think I will do the same thing with moving my cowl intake in the winter months.

The 40mm internally gated housing should be done in a few days to a week, I'll post images and results when it's ready.

Chris

 

gotcha. this was the line that threw me off. so what are you looking at for data logging? is it something you have to know compruters for? i not so good with them. or is it a whole set up that is actually designed for that purpose? anyway, interested in what you come up with for manipulating the inlet temps. i'm going to be working on an adjustable wastegate controller this weekend. i'll be able to adjust it in cab with some accuracy. hopefully it'll help me figure some things out.

on edit: i just realised that by inlet temps you would talking about outside temp?

 

yes by inlet I mean incoming air temp into the turbo from the air cleaner.

With as many channels as I want to monitor, logging would be the way to go to see all them them in graph form. This way, one can find any efficiencies throughout the system at various conditions and rpms.

http://www.sperscientific.com/images.../800023-24.pdf

This is the one I was looking at...not a true automotive unit, but it can be flush mounted fairly easily to look good...or stay mobile. It hooks to any computer via RS232 cord or USB, and comes with the software to produce the logs.

Turbine housing...getting closer. Northslope opened up the devider down to the end of the wastegate and did some minor clean up port work. The flapper is done and ended up 1 11/16" diameter...which is the absolut largest it can be and still fit within the housing and not bind on the walls. The wastegate hole I have opened up to 1 1/2". The flapper linkage is made, and I have modified the outside lever so the valve opens fully at the same actuator travel as stock. All I have left to do is machine the surface nice and flat so the valve will seat, and make the new hsg cover. I'll post pics when it's done.

 

so temp is the only thing you're going to log?

 

Wow, the wastegate mods sound very impressive, I cant wait till you get the thing done and share the results. If it all works out well is there a chance you will be selling the parts and pieces to modify my own?

 

temp is only one thing I'm going to log. I am building a mass sensor as well that will give me the air mass along the same log points. If I can integrate all of this into the right software, I would also like to map air pressures with a transducer(s). We'll see how all of that works out. Though the engine is completely mechanical, it would be cool to have some of the same electronic sensors, but at a higher level, as the newer engines have for fuel management. Of course, the beaty of it, is those sensors won't manage a thing!! Still have to get into the snap-on drawers for that.....the best of both worlds!

The turbine housing is fully machined now. The large internal gate is a reality. I now realize that I have enough room for a larger valve flapper if necessary, and can even go bigger on the gate port if I need to. I have a feeling though that I won't. I'll take some pictures tonight when I have more time and post up the result. The modifications aren't that involved, you just need access to a lathe, a mill, and some general tinkering skills. I suppose if it works out, I could duplicate the housing on request, though I am sure there are shops that are more suited to mass production than me. I have about 10 hours into this thing total, and I haven't made the new back flange yet...but that won't be difficult either. Anyway look for pictures tonight.

Chris

 

here they are......a little finish work still, but pretty much done.

 

*WOW* is about all i can say. looks like it'll work, uh? good stuff.

on another note, are you going to monitor anything else? i've been thinking about trying to do 3 air pressures, 3 temps, and 1 rpm. haven't had much luck finding anything that i'd be able to put together for less than, say, an autometer data system. and that is definitely out of my price range because i can't find a price. and we all know what that means.

dave

 

Sure sure sure there got... take 3 pictures of the work you did and only 1 of the work I did!!!! LOL just jokin!!!

Have you ever noticed that the HY35's have an open flange also? Atleast the pics that I've seen are open and not divided.