Bobcat698

Looking at doing some more work on the truck this winter.

I'd like to get some input on what works & what doesn't when it comes to cylinder head setups that work well.

I'm considering taking the head off of my truck, having it ported on the intake and exhaust sides, back cutting the valves, and installing billet retainers & keepers.
I also want to machine the intake manifold off and do a better porting job, then build a custom intake for it.

I'm also considering a 24V head to have Top Dead Center Injection for better atomization and burn.
I realize this will cost a bit more, but is it worth it in the long run?

Any input?

signature600

I'm in the process of having the same thing done...only I can't decide if it's worth cutting the manifold off or not.

One thing I will say, with the way you drive/treat your truck...buy a new head, that way you don't have to worry about dropping a valve seat or anything like that. Press in seats are a gamble at high EGT's!

Chris


NO FAIR!!! Posting a poll after I respond I used to want a P-pumped 24v, but now I'm not so sure! It can be a BIG pain to get to run right, not too mention it's a lot of extra money to get higher RPM! I'm gonna go with a 12v head...just not sure whether it'll be stock appearing or not

wana12v

p pump 24v are not hard to get running correctly. been there done that. just run alot of timing to them 30+. however im not convinced the heads are better due to how many people have trouble with valve seals. and ive seen way more of them drop valves.

signature600

That's another bad thing on the 24v's...valve maintainence!

As far as it being "easy" to get running correctly...not only could my opinion of easy be different than yours, but so could my definition of what correctly is!! And running 30+* isn't very good for starting at 20*F not plugged in (Not saying I won't end up timing my 12v in the 30's, just saying so for the sake of arguing)

Chris

wana12v

timing is based on where you want to make your power. In a sled pulling application with alot of rpms 30+ is definately not out of the question.

there is a 600psi difference between 12 and 24v injectors. were running a set of 200hp 24v edm's (waiting on a set of injectors for specific application) to make up for this you run the timing up higher. Brian Block suggested it and I did it and it worked. yes the truck is hard to start but most of that is due to the fly cut common rail pistons (cut to accept the high lift of the billet cam) with only 14:1 compression. however it is still daily driven.

Please tell me why it is hard to get them right? I have done it and it did not seem to hard to me. The only thing I would say we have done inncorrect is the injectors, and they are on the way. Besides timing what other tuning must be done?

Bobcat you will also have to put in different pistons with the correct bowl, it can be done in frame with the head and oil pan off, but that is not how I would do it.

strokethis600

I would also consider a ported 3rd gen head. I think this is the best option, darren from Dave's Diesel did it and it seems like a really good setup. the 3rd gen heads are awesome.

signature600

Here's my dilemma on a P-pumped 24v...I drive my truck every day, and some other people might drive it too. I don't want it belching smoke all the time, but I have fairly lofty goals for power too.

If I was building an all out pulling engine, I'd be more inclined to do what you've just described...but in a pulling application I would also lean towards the 12v head for it's simplicity, toughness, and how easy it is to get major RPM out of it. I still think the 24v head is better for flow, but is it actually better when you consider the cost involved with changing a 12v over to it....unless you're doing a rebuild, it's not worth it!

I also understand that different applications require different levels of timing...my 95 is at 17* because it tows heavy fairly often, not because I think it's better. My buddies truck (Joefarmer) is timed at 32* and won't start below 50* without cycling the grid heaters twice...granted that's not terrible, but a pain nonetheless!

BTW, in case you don't know, my goals for the 98 are a 12.0 second 1/4, with no/very little smoke once the chargers spool....and if I don't hit 12.0, I want to see how far I can go before I have to use nitrous to clean up the smoke. This won't be a smoke belching puller, or a truck that only makes 4 passes on a 15lb bottle. Is this better than everyone else...Nope, but it's what I want to do with my truck, so therefore it's better for me

Bobcat, you're gonna get a ton of opinions...but in the end I'll bet we'll agree that there is no "Best" way to build a truck, but you can find that way that's close enough for you to like it

Chris


BTW, Wana12v....I didn't answer some of your questions because I don't know specifics on injector pop pressures and such, and as far as other tuning involved that depends on how much you want to do! If you're happy with the way the truck runs, Great...but with what I want to do, I don't think it will be that simple. The p-pump is a great pump, but it's also not perfect. There are lots of thing to adjust to get it the way you want it....but I don't know most of them so that's all I can say

wana12v

well we did do a complete rebuild, and it is a little to much for a daily driver.

however you could have f1 (for example) do a cam with the 12v timing points, do a set of injectors with the correct pop pressures, and there are no other bug to work out. (except for head clearance, oil feed for pump ect.)
as far as adjusting the pump, it was built on a bench (215 with flat top plungers 550+cc's) we just bolted it on and added a little timing.

on a 12v you already have the correct timing cover.

bobcat- also in order to see any large gains the intake runner has to be cut off to allow the intake side to be ported. Indy cylinder head does really good work fyi.

signature600

Don't think the thought hasn't crossed my mind, and I also haven't decided exactly what I'm doing, either When it's all said and done, me and my vendor will decide what we both think is the best option for me....but right now, all my money's going to a tranny that'll handle what I'm gonna throw at it

Chris

Joker12valve

I say go with the stock head with the custom manifold. other wise you are looking at a full rebuild. and to toss another idea in to the mix how a bout larger exhust valves. on the idea that it would help move some of that air out of the head and help spool that larger charger that you should get. their are more reasons but i don' like to type. What do you think? worth trying?