Performance and Accessories 2nd gen only Talk about Dodge/Cummins aftermarket products for second generation trucks here. Can include high-performance mods, or general accessories.

12v upgrades?

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Old 06-05-2006, 09:28 PM
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Talking 12v upgrades?

this will most likely be a question for you all, but it would help me a ton if i could get some input.

im most like picking up a 12v later this week.
either a 94 or 96.

anyways, say i get the manual 5spd 2wd, if you had around $2500 for upgrades what would it be?

and say i have an auto 4wd, what would you choose with $2500?

thanks,
bill.
Old 06-05-2006, 09:35 PM
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Gauges, GSK, Plate, Con FE with upgraded input shaft (VB/TC if an auto) and intake intake/exhaust. May be enough left to hybrid the turbo.

I'm guessing you already know the basics of how these engines work?

And welcome to DTR!
Old 06-05-2006, 09:42 PM
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ive been searching / reseaching on them a little...
but school me if you got time, id really like to know all i can,
i learn something new everyday on acouple different forums, including this one.

thanks for the welcome.
Old 06-05-2006, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by TxDiesel007
THIS is just to get a little more power out of your ram. You can do serveral things, i see you are getting gauges, and you have an air intake on the way. which is good. Now this is an into to the main power source of the ram, Your P7100 Pump, and what you can tweak on it for more power. You can also time it, but thats advanced, well at least for me... use this as an intro more than anything.. I tried my best to explain it.... here goes... and

I meant to say post.... sorry.....

Here is an intro the link to the pic might not work, but u can see it as banks plate in my gallery.....

to get more power out of your truck the first and foremost investment is a good set of gauges. These are a must anytime that you are adding more fuel to your mix.

A governers spring kit, Reffered to as a GSK is a wonderful investment that widens your normally narrow powerband from the 12 valve engine and allows you to fuel hard to at least 3200 RPMS or so, before it starts to defuel, this is all dependant on your governer arm adjustment and your plate positioning. A Torque, or fuel plate should come next. NO one really follows the plate guide anymore and the most popular plates nowadays are 100 (PM northslope for wicked work! ) and a zero plate. Piers Diesel Research and Hot Rod Diesels have them for the same price, The fuel plate... here is my explanation....

Torque plates.... ok this is a torque plate right here...

More commonly reffered to as fuel plates, they come in different numbers to explain how "aggressive" (for lack of a better term at the moment) that they are 10, 8, 6, 5, 0, and 100, zero being a flatt plate that bombards the pump with fuel, and a 100 being a ten plate curve with no top end defueling, much like the zero.. The one you see there is my banks plate, screwy yes, i know, i dont get it myself. that plate goes in the P7100 injector pump, It goes under what is called the AFC housing, which has a little starwheel on it, the starwheel can be accessed with the removal of the hex dealy using the the right hex head size plug, and u loosen it for more smoke, and better lower end, and tighten it for the inverse. Use a good screwdriver.... furthermore... You will see four screws there where the starwheel is, two that are flatt, one that is possibly a breakoff screw that can be a real PITA to remove, take a hammer and good screwdriver and bang the tar outta it, it will come off, if that fails, left hand drill bit... Looking down the driver side, the top left hand is the breakaway, and the top right is a regular screw as well, the bottom two are 8mm bolts and you need to get around to one that is in the back of the AFC housing that holds that fuel shutdown solenoid in place...

Install time, for a newbie, well it will take you about a couple of hours at most. If you read my literal "dissertation" of a post hehehehehehe. it tells u the procedure on how to do it. Your only real problem might be that break off screw, especially if your truck is stock, However, nothing a good strong screwdriver and some persuasion cannot take care of.

The other tricky bolt is the one (if you look down from the drivers side) behind the Fuel shutdown soleniod (electronic hooked up deal that bolts in front of the injector pump, easily removed with in my case an 8mm (and most should be too) socket and pull out the two bolts. when you undo those ull notice that there is one in the back that is holding the housing, you can just loosen the one in the rear using a deep 8 mm socket and just move teh shutdown soleniod out of the way, (downward) and then you can get to the plate..

When you are in there its simple adjustment, u just remove the stock plate and put the other plate in place of that one. NOTICE you have some play here. If you dont have gauges, dont set it full forward, If you do have gauges set it forward for a 30 or so rwhp increase!

Now put it back together and you are done. Installation is simply the reverse of removing it.PS having a magnetic tip screwdriver REALLY HELPS...

Which one is right for you.. id say the ten if you are not gonna be that aggressive with it, but the 100 is downright WICKED!! that be the one to go with, the zero is just too much at the low end for me but for dynos and racin, its awesome!.. The zero, PM Northslope AWESOME AWESOME WORK, and ull be helpin out a fellow DTR member, and the zero plate you can grind yourself, well you can do either or, but PM northslope do a search for plate grinding, started by gunracer1.. good instructions..

Either ways, you are going to need a clutch or tranny work if its an auto.....if you are going to play hard, in most cases if you just want a modest power gain, just get a 10 plate, set it a lil bit forward, and a GSK will wake up your truck. In the stock position its easily drivable and fun as well.

Waste gate, if i was good with pictures id put one up for you, but im sure you know what the wastegate looks like, that head looking deal, it is usually hooked to a rubber or similar airline, you want a little more boost? You can get a longer hose or pinch it up, There is a thread, i dont member where tho, where it shows someone improperly blocking the wastgate with a screw.... Well that aint good.. Anyways

Also make sure you get the KDP done on that truck as well... Not hard to do, look in my previous posts, KDP Report Using TST kit, or somethin similar to that......

PS this is cut and paste of other posts, sorry if its redundant....

Best of luck and hope that this helps..

Tx
I copied this from Rick (and fixed an old pic link for the fuel plate (the one that is posted is a #0 plate)), he (and all the other guys on here) has tought me alot about the 12vs They have tought me pretty much everything I know about these engines... So technicaly this schooling comes from him. Just indirectly.

It is a good explanition, and introduction to the 12v, and modifying one.

Don't forget to tab the KDP when you get the truck. TST makes a kit, it's a pretty easy job, took me a few hours talking and drinking beer. And the pin was backed out about 1/4" on mine.

And TST also sells a boost elbow to let you increase boost.
Old 06-05-2006, 10:04 PM
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This is a link to pics of a cutaway P-Pump. They really helped me understand how one works.http://www.cumminsdatabase.com/read.php?id=182
Old 06-05-2006, 10:18 PM
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just read it, and im making a list. = )

can i get a little further explaining on the "Con FE with upgraded input shaft (VB/TC if an auto)" part... thanks.
Old 06-05-2006, 10:30 PM
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It is a very tough single disc clutch from South Bend. They make the premium clutch for our trucks.

http://www.southbendclutch.com/13-1.25fe.html
Old 06-05-2006, 10:41 PM
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Before you go throwin more fuel to the motor your definitely gonna need to beef up that stock automatic tranny with a hi performance valve body and torque convertor, Goerend, DTT, Suncoast and Haisley are all very well respected. If you get the manual get a good cluth if its slipping. Your also going to want to get at least a pyro and boost guage and may want to get a tranny temp guage. Some things you can do before spending a lot on the tranny is get the timing bumped to 16 degrees and get the valves adjusted and a new overflow valve and get a good intake, the ScottyII is great. This tune up plus the timing will make a great difference. I also got a 4" exhaust and Aeroturbine muffler and eliminated the cat. These things alone helped the drivabililty a LOT. You can also do the 3k of 4K governor spring mods before doin the tranny but you need a pyro guage.The Gov spring kit GSK is another GREAT bang for the buck ! Then after the tranny is ready, whoa get ready to have a lot of fun ! Bigger injectors, bigger delivery valves in the pump, more agressive fuel stop plates bigger turbos and on and on , the skys the limit mechanical is more fun the chips if you ask me. Get the '96 if you can its supposed to be the best year.
Old 06-05-2006, 11:02 PM
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so 94-98's don't accept those computers upgrades or chips eh?
all mechanical then?
Old 06-05-2006, 11:12 PM
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Late 98 models had the 24v, but untill then no chips. All mechanically controlled injection. And that is a good thing. 98 being the best of the 12v. It has the new dash that some don't like, but the rear doors are nice.

And I don't know why I always forget the valve adjust and timing... They do make a nice difference.
Old 06-06-2006, 01:14 AM
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thanks, whos next?

i have 14 to do's on my list, not sure how much i will do, i but as soon as i get the truck, ill post picks and ill be on my way to the 12 second club.
Old 06-06-2006, 02:14 AM
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oh, where is everyone's opinion on who is the best dealer / best on prices for these upgrades??

thanks.
Old 06-06-2006, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by displacedtexan
Late 98 models had the 24v, but untill then no chips. All mechanically controlled injection. And that is a good thing. 98 being the best of the 12v. It has the new dash that some don't like, but the rear doors are nice.

And I don't know why I always forget the valve adjust and timing... They do make a nice difference.

Couldnt have said this any better myself..

Timing alone will make a huge difference in the way that the truck runs. Valve adjustments in my opinion just help smooth out the way the truck runs and help out with mileage. Thanks for fixin my link tho, .

Nick did u get yours timed yet? Take it from me, i run a stock clutch, and im surprised how its holding up, it will hold 330 or so rwhp max, so if you are slipping it, its a good indicator that you are at or above 300 rwhp, Im just factorin in wear and tear. Timing tho will make u feel like u lost a little on the lower end, powerwise, but after 2000 rpms, GOOD LORD! The truck will just light and ull have a fun ride, till you defuel because of your plate, or run out of RPMS.. U can run the 100 and laser cuts, just cant play around very often.

Ive said it before, and ill say it again, my truck this is what works. I run a 2/3 forward 100, 191 DV's, Full back AFC, and finally a 1/2 starwheel, The results are actually little to no smoke even on hard take offs, and it seems to me that the fuel is bein burned really well as the truck seems to spool up well and launch pretty decently. Mind you, DV"s and slipping clutch can serve as variables here, but then again no two trucks are always alike... Just sayin what works for me

As far as teh question on who has the best prices? ive been helped by too many people, and the good thing for the 12V, there is alot of free power with some simple adjustments. I would try mike at www.hotroddiesels.com, or garrett at www.blackclouddieselperformance.com. Both are good guys and know their stuff...

Rick
Old 06-06-2006, 08:58 AM
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Rick, yeah, I had mine timed to 16.5* a few months back. At the same time I had my valves done. I had a road trip and no time, so I just paid to have it done. The timing made a huge difference, and the valve adjust was nice.

I have my plate full forward, AFC full forward, starwheel couple clicks tight from full off. I need to change a little though. Smoke is getting bad in the heat. Was pushing on being to much smoke before. May grind mine to a 100 and pull it back a little. I still have the 181s. After the clutch I think I'm gonna go to lazer cuts. Guess what I'm gonna do this weekend.

And I slipped my clutch once Trying not to do it again till we get situiated in the house.

And you're welcome on the link.
Old 06-06-2006, 11:43 AM
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thanks, and whats the best "snow water meth" setup? brand name?


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