12v Modifications - Injectors and Turbo - 400hp or more?
11-06-2007 | 04:00 PM
#1
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12v Modifications - Injectors and Turbo - 400hp or more?
Well I have done the basics and want to move to the next level. Like most I've ground my plate, added the boost elbow, BHAF, 4" MBRP, and adjusted my pump a little. Then safety and the 47RE needed addressed so I put guages in and will be installing a Suncoast Triple Disk 91% converter with a HTS valve body this weekend. The very next thing on the list is the GSK mod, thats a given. It's a toss up between 4k and 3k. I'm not sure what the 4k would do for me that the 3k wouldnt, but I'm still reading up on that.
Now moving to the meat and potatoes, injectors and turbos. After adding the guages I noticed my boost under lockup would hit the upper 30's and right to 40 with no problem. EGT's were managable. This was without the boost elbow even being put on. I know that's too high and I dont want to over work the HX35, so upgrading is what comes to my mind. I would probably do the turbo first and the the injectors second, since I am thinking the stock modified fueling could support more turbo before the turbo could support more fuel.
I know 3/4 of the folks here dont like the HX40 and the marine injectors. I understand the shaft is the same on the HX40 as the HX35 and the 370 injectors dont have the perfect spray pattern. Although I am on a tight budget and I cant afford $800-1400 for a turbo and $500+ for injectors. I just cant. These items seem like a step above stock, but not so much that it's way out of my price range. So with that being said could the HX40 cool the 370's? How about 300 or 330 ones? I dont tow, so that isnt a concern. What boost level could the HX40 survive? I wont be maxxing the boost daily, I just want to know if they would work for 95% daily driving and 5% messing with a Powerstroke, Duramax, or ricer on the street.
Could I run 14's in the 1/4 mile with this combo? Would this setup net me 400hp?
I know it might be a bit more laggy, alot more smoke and higher EGT's overall, but I'm the kinda guy who used to daily drive my 12 second Z28. I'm not the guy who wants comforterable shifts and a soft riding truck. I dont mind some overkill...I put a full manual valve body 4L80E into a 1994 Z28
This would be a setup I'd run for a year or so until I could do a full 47RE build and a big single or twins.
I know it's alot of questions, but I've done alot of searching and cant find exactly what I am looking for. So let me hear what you guys think.
-Dustin-
Now moving to the meat and potatoes, injectors and turbos. After adding the guages I noticed my boost under lockup would hit the upper 30's and right to 40 with no problem. EGT's were managable. This was without the boost elbow even being put on. I know that's too high and I dont want to over work the HX35, so upgrading is what comes to my mind. I would probably do the turbo first and the the injectors second, since I am thinking the stock modified fueling could support more turbo before the turbo could support more fuel.
I know 3/4 of the folks here dont like the HX40 and the marine injectors. I understand the shaft is the same on the HX40 as the HX35 and the 370 injectors dont have the perfect spray pattern. Although I am on a tight budget and I cant afford $800-1400 for a turbo and $500+ for injectors. I just cant. These items seem like a step above stock, but not so much that it's way out of my price range. So with that being said could the HX40 cool the 370's? How about 300 or 330 ones? I dont tow, so that isnt a concern. What boost level could the HX40 survive? I wont be maxxing the boost daily, I just want to know if they would work for 95% daily driving and 5% messing with a Powerstroke, Duramax, or ricer on the street.
Could I run 14's in the 1/4 mile with this combo? Would this setup net me 400hp?
I know it might be a bit more laggy, alot more smoke and higher EGT's overall, but I'm the kinda guy who used to daily drive my 12 second Z28. I'm not the guy who wants comforterable shifts and a soft riding truck. I dont mind some overkill...I put a full manual valve body 4L80E into a 1994 Z28
This would be a setup I'd run for a year or so until I could do a full 47RE build and a big single or twins.
I know it's alot of questions, but I've done alot of searching and cant find exactly what I am looking for. So let me hear what you guys think.
-Dustin-
11-06-2007 | 06:59 PM
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Many have cooled the 370s with a HX40, no it's not state of the art, but it has worked well for many in the past. Gate your 40 at 40 psi or so and it should live a long healthy life, they don't like steady diets of high boost.
That combo should be good for 400-420 hp, and is what I intend on running after I do my clutch.
That combo should be good for 400-420 hp, and is what I intend on running after I do my clutch.
11-06-2007 | 10:10 PM
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 8,311
Likes: 52
From: Holly Ridge, N.C.
Well I have done the basics and want to move to the next level. Like most I've ground my plate, added the boost elbow, BHAF, 4" MBRP, and adjusted my pump a little. Then safety and the 47RE needed addressed so I put guages in and will be installing a Suncoast Triple Disk 91% converter with a HTS valve body this weekend. The very next thing on the list is the GSK mod, thats a given. It's a toss up between 4k and 3k. I'm not sure what the 4k would do for me that the 3k wouldnt, but I'm still reading up on that.
Now moving to the meat and potatoes, injectors and turbos. After adding the guages I noticed my boost under lockup would hit the upper 30's and right to 40 with no problem. EGT's were managable. This was without the boost elbow even being put on. I know that's too high and I dont want to over work the HX35, so upgrading is what comes to my mind. I would probably do the turbo first and the the injectors second, since I am thinking the stock modified fueling could support more turbo before the turbo could support more fuel.
I know 3/4 of the folks here dont like the HX40 and the marine injectors. I understand the shaft is the same on the HX40 as the HX35 and the 370 injectors dont have the perfect spray pattern. Although I am on a tight budget and I cant afford $800-1400 for a turbo and $500+ for injectors. I just cant. These items seem like a step above stock, but not so much that it's way out of my price range. So with that being said could the HX40 cool the 370's? How about 300 or 330 ones? I dont tow, so that isnt a concern. What boost level could the HX40 survive? I wont be maxxing the boost daily, I just want to know if they would work for 95% daily driving and 5% messing with a Powerstroke, Duramax, or ricer on the street.
Could I run 14's in the 1/4 mile with this combo? Would this setup net me 400hp?
I know it might be a bit more laggy, alot more smoke and higher EGT's overall, but I'm the kinda guy who used to daily drive my 12 second Z28. I'm not the guy who wants comforterable shifts and a soft riding truck. I dont mind some overkill...I put a full manual valve body 4L80E into a 1994 Z28
This would be a setup I'd run for a year or so until I could do a full 47RE build and a big single or twins.
I know it's alot of questions, but I've done alot of searching and cant find exactly what I am looking for. So let me hear what you guys think.
-Dustin-
Now moving to the meat and potatoes, injectors and turbos. After adding the guages I noticed my boost under lockup would hit the upper 30's and right to 40 with no problem. EGT's were managable. This was without the boost elbow even being put on. I know that's too high and I dont want to over work the HX35, so upgrading is what comes to my mind. I would probably do the turbo first and the the injectors second, since I am thinking the stock modified fueling could support more turbo before the turbo could support more fuel.
I know 3/4 of the folks here dont like the HX40 and the marine injectors. I understand the shaft is the same on the HX40 as the HX35 and the 370 injectors dont have the perfect spray pattern. Although I am on a tight budget and I cant afford $800-1400 for a turbo and $500+ for injectors. I just cant. These items seem like a step above stock, but not so much that it's way out of my price range. So with that being said could the HX40 cool the 370's? How about 300 or 330 ones? I dont tow, so that isnt a concern. What boost level could the HX40 survive? I wont be maxxing the boost daily, I just want to know if they would work for 95% daily driving and 5% messing with a Powerstroke, Duramax, or ricer on the street.
Could I run 14's in the 1/4 mile with this combo? Would this setup net me 400hp?
I know it might be a bit more laggy, alot more smoke and higher EGT's overall, but I'm the kinda guy who used to daily drive my 12 second Z28. I'm not the guy who wants comforterable shifts and a soft riding truck. I dont mind some overkill...I put a full manual valve body 4L80E into a 1994 Z28
This would be a setup I'd run for a year or so until I could do a full 47RE build and a big single or twins.
I know it's alot of questions, but I've done alot of searching and cant find exactly what I am looking for. So let me hear what you guys think.
-Dustin-
Dustin:
I read your post and thought I would try to help you here a little bit.
As you can see from my signature, I have a 1996 Dodge CTD 12 valve and have owned the truck since new. A few years ago, before I got to the performance level I am at now, I ran an HX-40/16 AND the 370 Injectors in my 96' and had very good luck with the set-up. As long as you keep the boost on the HX-40 limited to around 38-40lbs you shouldn't have any problems. I ran mine for over three years with no problems whatsoever!
As you said, the 370's aren't the "perfect" injector as far as smoke etc., but they do work well for what you are trying to do and they are pretty reasonably priced now too. I daily drove my 96' with that set-up AND also towed with it. IMHO, it is a good set-up. With the set-up you described, I think you should be able to hit 400 H.P. and if not you will be real close to it.
On the governor spring issue I would recommend going with the 4K springs.
It really seemed to help my truck, especially on the top end. They are "touchy" to get adjusted right, but once you are there, IMHO, they are better than the 3K springs and I ran both but wished I had just gone with the 4K's from the start. I had bought the 3K's first, then sold them and bought the 4K's.
Anyway, I hope this has helped you some. Good luck to you!
--------
John_P
11-07-2007 | 12:25 AM
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It's a toss up between 4k and 3k. I'm not sure what the 4k would do for me that the 3k wouldn't, but I'm still reading up on that.
First let me start off with this as I do with all who begin this venture...
Remember once you get to a point HP gained will cost more and more.What I mean by that is as long as you understand that as you get higher the cost for the next minuscule amount of power can be at times twice what you spent to get where you came from.As long as you remember HP is not free nor is it cheap,then your on your way.
I would agree with John_P and say go to the 4k's first,however they do come at a cost above the 3k kit as you will need the bigger valve springs to handle the higher rpm loads.The 4's are very touchy at first but simple adjustments will make them smooth as you want.
Now moving to the meat and potatoes, injectors and turbos.
Its my opinion that the 370's are the most under rated injector abound for the 12v's.You will find no other injector that will net you the HP for dollar spent value that a 370 will.Yes,they haze a little,but many have made big power using just them and this writer has seen 792hp on #2 alone with them in person.That number was set years ago at one of our clubs dyno events and stood until this year when John_P took it with a 817 roll.You will be fine with 370's if thats what you want.
As for the 14's with the truck,well,thats a all about cubic dollars deal.If you have the dollars then anything can be done and only you set the limits.I am not a diesel drag race fan as I have been alot faster on gas and diesel drag racing is of no interest to me.I wouldn't want to even guess what you could do as you wallet will determine that.
Two last little tidbits and I'll step out....
One is to consider the extra stress you head gasket is going to endure and you may have to budget yourself for a head gasket job and ringing the head.With the added fuel,added boost and timing it will raise the cylinder pressures which will remove the next weak link,your head gasket.
The second one is this and I learned it the hard way.There is ZERO substitute out there for having a pump built by a reputable pump man or having yours flowed on a rack and properly set up.While I do realize everyones taste is for the easy way on the wallet,once you have your pump done right you will not regret it.You would be amazes at what you will find and may pick up when you budget your money to spend by doing that instead of just adding parts to yours.
Remember...
200 to 300 hp is relatively easy on your wallet.
300 to 400 hp will cost you more to do it correctly.
400 to 600 hp is about double what you spent so far to get here.
600 and beyond may require a few trips to the see the banker,a few skinned knuckles due to frustration,a doctors visit for blood pressure medication and stitches,stock in a dyno business and lots of time away from home tuning.
My advice...Don't rush it,do it the right way and set goals you can attain for the budget you want to spend,otherwise all you end up with is a pile of bills and a heartache,trust me on that one..........Andy
11-07-2007 | 01:31 AM
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 241
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----------------
Dustin:
I read your post and thought I would try to help you here a little bit. I appriciate it sir.
As you can see from my signature, I have a 1996 Dodge CTD 12 valve and have owned the truck since new. A few years ago, before I got to the performance level I am at now, I ran an HX-40/16 AND the 370 Injectors in my 96' and had very good luck with the set-up. As long as you keep the boost on the HX-40 limited to around 38-40lbs you shouldn't have any problems. I ran mine for over three years with no problems whatsoever!
As you said, the 370's aren't the "perfect" injector as far as smoke etc., but they do work well for what you are trying to do and they are pretty reasonably priced now too. I daily drove my 96' with that set-up AND also towed with it. IMHO, it is a good set-up. With the set-up you described, I think you should be able to hit 400 H.P. and if not you will be real close to it.
Exactly the kind of information I am looking for. I'm looking for a good balance between my transmission modifications, the head gasket, daily driving ability, and my budget. I dont want to go too deep with it right now, but enough that the truck will demand respect. The mentioned combination would get me there I think.
On the governor spring issue I would recommend going with the 4K springs.
It really seemed to help my truck, especially on the top end. They are "touchy" to get adjusted right, but once you are there, IMHO, they are better than the 3K springs and I ran both but wished I had just gone with the 4K's from the start. I had bought the 3K's first, then sold them and bought the 4K's.
People I have talked to who have tried both have said just go 4k with the GSK. I definately dont mind, but the valve springs will be necessary, just takes a bit more cash and me knowing how to do them on a 6BT rather than a SBC
Anyway, I hope this has helped you some. Good luck to you!
It has, and I thank you for taking the time to post your knowledge and experiences
--------
John_P
Dustin:
I read your post and thought I would try to help you here a little bit. I appriciate it sir.
As you can see from my signature, I have a 1996 Dodge CTD 12 valve and have owned the truck since new. A few years ago, before I got to the performance level I am at now, I ran an HX-40/16 AND the 370 Injectors in my 96' and had very good luck with the set-up. As long as you keep the boost on the HX-40 limited to around 38-40lbs you shouldn't have any problems. I ran mine for over three years with no problems whatsoever!
As you said, the 370's aren't the "perfect" injector as far as smoke etc., but they do work well for what you are trying to do and they are pretty reasonably priced now too. I daily drove my 96' with that set-up AND also towed with it. IMHO, it is a good set-up. With the set-up you described, I think you should be able to hit 400 H.P. and if not you will be real close to it.
Exactly the kind of information I am looking for. I'm looking for a good balance between my transmission modifications, the head gasket, daily driving ability, and my budget. I dont want to go too deep with it right now, but enough that the truck will demand respect. The mentioned combination would get me there I think.
On the governor spring issue I would recommend going with the 4K springs.
It really seemed to help my truck, especially on the top end. They are "touchy" to get adjusted right, but once you are there, IMHO, they are better than the 3K springs and I ran both but wished I had just gone with the 4K's from the start. I had bought the 3K's first, then sold them and bought the 4K's.
People I have talked to who have tried both have said just go 4k with the GSK. I definately dont mind, but the valve springs will be necessary, just takes a bit more cash and me knowing how to do them on a 6BT rather than a SBC
Anyway, I hope this has helped you some. Good luck to you!
It has, and I thank you for taking the time to post your knowledge and experiences
--------
John_P
Dustin...
First let me start off with this as I do with all who begin this venture...
Remember once you get to a point HP gained will cost more and more.What I mean by that is as long as you understand that as you get higher the cost for the next minuscule amount of power can be at times twice what you spent to get where you came from.As long as you remember HP is not free nor is it cheap,then your on your way.
Coming from the performance world of GM Muscle cars I completely understand where your coming from. Same went for my Z28. Adding exhaust, intake and PCM modifications were cheap, easy, and gained good HP. After than the transmission needed upgraded, then I went into the motor, lots of money there, now I'm building a 9" for it. Some folks dont understand this which makes it an excellent point to make.
I would agree with John_P and say go to the 4k's first,however they do come at a cost above the 3k kit as you will need the bigger valve springs to handle the higher rpm loads.The 4's are very touchy at first but simple adjustments will make them smooth as you want.
Again, everyone has been telling me that. My only concern were talks of idle RPM's being too high or surging. If those issues can be cleared up, then I'm all for the redzone.
The HX40 is a great choice and can easily handle 400rwhp easily.There are those who will tell you stay away from them but as with anything if you understand its limits,then you can make it work.One thing that has been learned with the HX40's since they came on the scene long ago is to have the covers pinned on to ensure the compressor housing stays put.IF you have the HX40 pinned short bursts over 40lbs of boost will not kill it but without pinning you could lift fast and pop the housing and break the turbo.They are good and sound until about 40lbs of boost,beyond that they are out of map and create heat.
I have been getting alot of flack from folks about even considering the HX40. Most are the type with budget's allowing for Pro Street 66's and things of that sort. Although I see it as a good middle ground and a very good candidate for my particular goals and budget. I probably wouldnt be running one over 40lbs, it's a daily driver and I need it to hold together. I appriciate the information on pinning the covers. I never read anything about that and I'll have to see what I have to get together to do that.
Its my opinion that the 370's are the most under rated injector abound for the 12v's.You will find no other injector that will net you the HP for dollar spent value that a 370 will.Yes,they haze a little,but many have made big power using just them and this writer has seen 792hp on #2 alone with them in person.That number was set years ago at one of our clubs dyno events and stood until this year when John_P took it with a 817 roll.You will be fine with 370's if thats what you want.
Again I appriciate the information. I understand there are better options, but for a bang for the buck injector with a good ability to grow I think they are hard to beat. I dont mind haze and I dont mind smoke, but I do want to keep EGT's in check, hence the HX40.
As for the 14's with the truck,well,thats a all about cubic dollars deal.If you have the dollars then anything can be done and only you set the limits.I am not a diesel drag race fan as I have been alot faster on gas and diesel drag racing is of no interest to me.I wouldn't want to even guess what you could do as you wallet will determine that.
The truck isnt my 1/4 mile baby, the Z28 is. Although this isnt to say if I wanted to settle a score with my buddies Duramax at the track I'd be turning him down. The 1/4 mile thing is just something to gauge were I stand compared to the Powerstrokes and Duramax's in a foot race. That time would be highly determined by a boosted launch. Budget 47RE = not billet parts = no boosted launches. But I am hoping the 400hp range would be able to take out some stock or stock + programmer Duramax's.
Two last little tidbits and I'll step out....
One is to consider the extra stress you head gasket is going to endure and you may have to budget yourself for a head gasket job and ringing the head.With the added fuel,added boost and timing it will raise the cylinder pressures which will remove the next weak link,your head gasket.
I'll be honest I was trying to avoid this monster by sticking to moderate modifications. I guess it's one of those things that I may slide on for a while, but it might get me eventually. Thanks for the heads up.
The second one is this and I learned it the hard way.There is ZERO substitute out there for having a pump built by a reputable pump man or having yours flowed on a rack and properly set up.While I do realize everyones taste is for the easy way on the wallet,once you have your pump done right you will not regret it.You would be amazes at what you will find and may pick up when you budget your money to spend by doing that instead of just adding parts to yours.
Definately a consideration when the time comes.
Remember...
200 to 300 hp is relatively easy on your wallet.
300 to 400 hp will cost you more to do it correctly.
400 to 600 hp is about double what you spent so far to get here.
600 and beyond may require a few trips to the see the banker,a few skinned knuckles due to frustration,a doctors visit for blood pressure medication and stitches,stock in a dyno business and lots of time away from home tuning.
True. I think the mods I have listed will take the winter to get and install and they will be on the truck for at least a year before upping the ainte. [I'm moving back home to Ohio in the summer, find a new job, find a place to live, so that will limit funds for both vehicles]
My advice...Don't rush it,do it the right way and set goals you can attain for the budget you want to spend,otherwise all you end up with is a pile of bills and a heartache,trust me on that one..........Andy
Yea, that's what I tried to do. I have a HT3B I could make twins with, and I was going to do that. But reality set in, I'd need studs, transmission mods, timing pulled, all kinds of stuff. Which is why I wanted to keep the Cummins mild and have left over's to get the Z28 into the 10's next year.
Thanks very much Andy!
First let me start off with this as I do with all who begin this venture...
Remember once you get to a point HP gained will cost more and more.What I mean by that is as long as you understand that as you get higher the cost for the next minuscule amount of power can be at times twice what you spent to get where you came from.As long as you remember HP is not free nor is it cheap,then your on your way.
Coming from the performance world of GM Muscle cars I completely understand where your coming from. Same went for my Z28. Adding exhaust, intake and PCM modifications were cheap, easy, and gained good HP. After than the transmission needed upgraded, then I went into the motor, lots of money there, now I'm building a 9" for it. Some folks dont understand this which makes it an excellent point to make.
I would agree with John_P and say go to the 4k's first,however they do come at a cost above the 3k kit as you will need the bigger valve springs to handle the higher rpm loads.The 4's are very touchy at first but simple adjustments will make them smooth as you want.
Again, everyone has been telling me that. My only concern were talks of idle RPM's being too high or surging. If those issues can be cleared up, then I'm all for the redzone.
The HX40 is a great choice and can easily handle 400rwhp easily.There are those who will tell you stay away from them but as with anything if you understand its limits,then you can make it work.One thing that has been learned with the HX40's since they came on the scene long ago is to have the covers pinned on to ensure the compressor housing stays put.IF you have the HX40 pinned short bursts over 40lbs of boost will not kill it but without pinning you could lift fast and pop the housing and break the turbo.They are good and sound until about 40lbs of boost,beyond that they are out of map and create heat.
I have been getting alot of flack from folks about even considering the HX40. Most are the type with budget's allowing for Pro Street 66's and things of that sort. Although I see it as a good middle ground and a very good candidate for my particular goals and budget. I probably wouldnt be running one over 40lbs, it's a daily driver and I need it to hold together. I appriciate the information on pinning the covers. I never read anything about that and I'll have to see what I have to get together to do that.
Its my opinion that the 370's are the most under rated injector abound for the 12v's.You will find no other injector that will net you the HP for dollar spent value that a 370 will.Yes,they haze a little,but many have made big power using just them and this writer has seen 792hp on #2 alone with them in person.That number was set years ago at one of our clubs dyno events and stood until this year when John_P took it with a 817 roll.You will be fine with 370's if thats what you want.
Again I appriciate the information. I understand there are better options, but for a bang for the buck injector with a good ability to grow I think they are hard to beat. I dont mind haze and I dont mind smoke, but I do want to keep EGT's in check, hence the HX40.
As for the 14's with the truck,well,thats a all about cubic dollars deal.If you have the dollars then anything can be done and only you set the limits.I am not a diesel drag race fan as I have been alot faster on gas and diesel drag racing is of no interest to me.I wouldn't want to even guess what you could do as you wallet will determine that.
The truck isnt my 1/4 mile baby, the Z28 is. Although this isnt to say if I wanted to settle a score with my buddies Duramax at the track I'd be turning him down. The 1/4 mile thing is just something to gauge were I stand compared to the Powerstrokes and Duramax's in a foot race. That time would be highly determined by a boosted launch. Budget 47RE = not billet parts = no boosted launches. But I am hoping the 400hp range would be able to take out some stock or stock + programmer Duramax's.
Two last little tidbits and I'll step out....
One is to consider the extra stress you head gasket is going to endure and you may have to budget yourself for a head gasket job and ringing the head.With the added fuel,added boost and timing it will raise the cylinder pressures which will remove the next weak link,your head gasket.
I'll be honest I was trying to avoid this monster by sticking to moderate modifications. I guess it's one of those things that I may slide on for a while, but it might get me eventually. Thanks for the heads up.
The second one is this and I learned it the hard way.There is ZERO substitute out there for having a pump built by a reputable pump man or having yours flowed on a rack and properly set up.While I do realize everyones taste is for the easy way on the wallet,once you have your pump done right you will not regret it.You would be amazes at what you will find and may pick up when you budget your money to spend by doing that instead of just adding parts to yours.
Definately a consideration when the time comes.
Remember...
200 to 300 hp is relatively easy on your wallet.
300 to 400 hp will cost you more to do it correctly.
400 to 600 hp is about double what you spent so far to get here.
600 and beyond may require a few trips to the see the banker,a few skinned knuckles due to frustration,a doctors visit for blood pressure medication and stitches,stock in a dyno business and lots of time away from home tuning.
True. I think the mods I have listed will take the winter to get and install and they will be on the truck for at least a year before upping the ainte. [I'm moving back home to Ohio in the summer, find a new job, find a place to live, so that will limit funds for both vehicles]
My advice...Don't rush it,do it the right way and set goals you can attain for the budget you want to spend,otherwise all you end up with is a pile of bills and a heartache,trust me on that one..........Andy
Yea, that's what I tried to do. I have a HT3B I could make twins with, and I was going to do that. But reality set in, I'd need studs, transmission mods, timing pulled, all kinds of stuff. Which is why I wanted to keep the Cummins mild and have left over's to get the Z28 into the 10's next year.
Thanks very much Andy!
So I guess the things I have to consider now are...
Keeping my stock HX35 or trading/selling it for the HX40?
Finding a good HX40
I will need a different downpipe...with that down pipe should I move from a 4" to 5" exhaust to help EGT's, get a deeper tone, and have more room to grow? And do they make 5" kits to fit 2nd Gen HX40 setups?
How do I adjust timing?
Watch for these threads coming to the DTR soon!
-Dustin-
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11-07-2007 | 02:11 AM
#8
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 3,077
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From: Garrard county, Kentucky
I think the HX40 is very underated myself. I think if you keep the boost reasonable,and can keep from barking them a lot, they are as good of a turbo as any for its size. Most likely that is what i will be running when I upgrade. I can get basically a new one for 1/3 the price of something like a SPS62. As for the 14 second quarter mile, that should be easy. I ran a 15.02 on a 90+ degree day with my 181 delivery valves, and the 191's has woke it up a lot since then, so I know it has 14's in it now. Stock turbo pushing 40psi.
Eric
Eric
11-07-2007 | 03:45 AM
#9
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 586
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From: Bend, Oregon
I would say new era unless that $100 will kill you... hx35/40 are common because they work and their cheap, til you need a 14wg housing then you might as well just go buy exactly what you want. I have similar goals but I tow a lot and most of the time it's horses. So smoke is an issue for me so I am looking into either finding a sister turbo and some 3" piping or doing the hybrid 35/40 with 181 or 191 dv's (where do you get those by the way?? for a good deal?) and to top it off probably a 3gsk (I don't need the xtra rev) fueled by new era 330's. I also just had my tranny built so it will be a while till I can afford power mods... head gasket next week also, bleh (I'm broke already and I only have 160hp...)
11-07-2007 | 01:33 PM
#10
Administrator
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 8,311
Likes: 52
From: Holly Ridge, N.C.
I greatly appriciate all the information I am getting on this topic. I figured I was going to get shot down on two "no-no" items and have to go about figuring out the stuff on my own. My main goal for this project is to get the most out of my setup without having to take the 'bigger' steps in modification. I am talking about head studs, lots of timing, big transmission mods, expensive turbos and injectors. I want it to be a fun truck to drive, but it's not my only toy and I want to be able to play with my Z28 too.
So I guess the things I have to consider now are...
Keeping my stock HX35 or trading/selling it for the HX40?
Finding a good HX40
I will need a different downpipe...with that down pipe should I move from a 4" to 5" exhaust to help EGT's, get a deeper tone, and have more room to grow? And do they make 5" kits to fit 2nd Gen HX40 setups?
How do I adjust timing?
Watch for these threads coming to the DTR soon!
-Dustin-
So I guess the things I have to consider now are...
Keeping my stock HX35 or trading/selling it for the HX40?
Finding a good HX40
I will need a different downpipe...with that down pipe should I move from a 4" to 5" exhaust to help EGT's, get a deeper tone, and have more room to grow? And do they make 5" kits to fit 2nd Gen HX40 setups?
How do I adjust timing?
Watch for these threads coming to the DTR soon!
-Dustin-
Dustin:
You are very welcome from my end and I know from Andy's (Hammer) as well!
Like myself, Hammer has been through all this on his 12 valve too and believe me, we have both learned ALOT what works and what doesn't! One thing about us is we are NOT going to tell you to do something or recommend anything that we know DOES NOT work,......and believe me there is alot of that type of thing going on in the industry right now.
I wanted to try and answer some more of your questions in your last post.
1.) Turbo choice- I would recommend selling your HX-35 and buying that HX-40. Shop around Dustin and also check the classified ads here or E-Bay. They are out there, you just have to look a little.
2.) Yes, you will need another downpipe for that HX-40. because the exhaust flange is larger than the HX-35. Stick with the 16 exhaust housing on the HX-40. The 18 is way too big, and it has ALOT of lag!! I know because I tried it on mine!
3.) Exhaust system- DO NOT waste your money on 5" exhaust systems! A 4" is plenty good and IMHO you can probably do just fine with your stock system as long as your cat isn't plugged up and you go with a "high flow muffler" such as a Walker #21468 (3" in 3" out) or a Walker #21471
(4" in 4" out). With my truck I NEVER gained ANY H.P. increase when I went from the stock exhaust to the 4" system I have now. The 4" system on my 96'
is the SAME system I had when I was at 400 H.P. and that system now works just fine with an engine putting out over 800 H.P.
--------
John_P
11-07-2007 | 03:25 PM
#11
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 241
Likes: 0
---------------
Dustin:
You are very welcome from my end and I know from Andy's (Hammer) as well!
Like myself, Hammer has been through all this on his 12 valve too and believe me, we have both learned ALOT what works and what doesn't! One thing about us is we are NOT going to tell you to do something or recommend anything that we know DOES NOT work,......and believe me there is alot of that type of thing going on in the industry right now.
I definately appriciate it and understand what your saying.
I wanted to try and answer some more of your questions in your last post.
1.) Turbo choice- I would recommend selling your HX-35 and buying that HX-40. Shop around Dustin and also check the classified ads here or E-Bay. They are out there, you just have to look a little.
I have seen a few here and there, although I need one that is bolt on ready since it's my daily driver. Keep your eye out for one if you can
2.) Yes, you will need another downpipe for that HX-40. because the exhaust flange is larger than the HX-35. Stick with the 16 exhaust housing on the HX-40. The 18 is way too big, and it has ALOT of lag!! I know because I tried it on mine!
Alright 16 exhaust housing, check.
3.) Exhaust system- DO NOT waste your money on 5" exhaust systems! A 4" is plenty good and IMHO you can probably do just fine with your stock system as long as your cat isn't plugged up and you go with a "high flow muffler" such as a Walker #21468 (3" in 3" out) or a Walker #21471
(4" in 4" out). With my truck I NEVER gained ANY H.P. increase when I went from the stock exhaust to the 4" system I have now. The 4" system on my 96'
is the SAME system I had when I was at 400 H.P. and that system now works just fine with an engine putting out over 800 H.P.
Well, I have a straight piped 4" MBRP S/S system right now, as long as that's enough I'll leave it alone. It came with the truck and included the muffler, so I cant complain. Should I contact MBRP for a matching HX40 downpipe or will any of them work?
--------
John_P
Dustin:
You are very welcome from my end and I know from Andy's (Hammer) as well!
Like myself, Hammer has been through all this on his 12 valve too and believe me, we have both learned ALOT what works and what doesn't! One thing about us is we are NOT going to tell you to do something or recommend anything that we know DOES NOT work,......and believe me there is alot of that type of thing going on in the industry right now.
I definately appriciate it and understand what your saying.
I wanted to try and answer some more of your questions in your last post.
1.) Turbo choice- I would recommend selling your HX-35 and buying that HX-40. Shop around Dustin and also check the classified ads here or E-Bay. They are out there, you just have to look a little.
I have seen a few here and there, although I need one that is bolt on ready since it's my daily driver. Keep your eye out for one if you can
2.) Yes, you will need another downpipe for that HX-40. because the exhaust flange is larger than the HX-35. Stick with the 16 exhaust housing on the HX-40. The 18 is way too big, and it has ALOT of lag!! I know because I tried it on mine!
Alright 16 exhaust housing, check.
3.) Exhaust system- DO NOT waste your money on 5" exhaust systems! A 4" is plenty good and IMHO you can probably do just fine with your stock system as long as your cat isn't plugged up and you go with a "high flow muffler" such as a Walker #21468 (3" in 3" out) or a Walker #21471
(4" in 4" out). With my truck I NEVER gained ANY H.P. increase when I went from the stock exhaust to the 4" system I have now. The 4" system on my 96'
is the SAME system I had when I was at 400 H.P. and that system now works just fine with an engine putting out over 800 H.P.
Well, I have a straight piped 4" MBRP S/S system right now, as long as that's enough I'll leave it alone. It came with the truck and included the muffler, so I cant complain. Should I contact MBRP for a matching HX40 downpipe or will any of them work?
--------
John_P
-Dustin-
11-08-2007 | 12:16 AM
#14
Banned
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 254
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Dustin...
As John has said again the turbo you want for your budget is a HX40.I would strongly reccomend you have it pinned to ensure longevity and your piece of mind.Rammin On has been thrashing on hisPDR HX40 now for about 5-6 years and his ride does around 500 to the ground.And trust me when I say keith does not let Casper rest as he is always on the throttle.
On exhausts...
One my 98 when it was a custom HX35 I ran a 4inch and loved the sound.It wasn't until I got a good buy on a 5" that I changed it over.I called the resident HP and forgot more than I will ever learn Cummins guru Rammin On out in his shop in Missouri about the step up.His exact words were WHY and that I would loose HP and raise the torque number as the exhaust would cool inside the pipe instead of flowing out.I laughed and amde a bet with him and promptly lost too.With no other changes in my truck I went back to the jet and lost 13hp and gained about 100 ft lbs of torque due to the bigger exhaust.Called Keith back and ate crow and still owe him a steak when I go visit sometime.4inch is all you need and as JP has said contact MBRP as their kits are very reasonably priced.If you want I know a guy out here who also stocks them and can sell you and ship one........Andy
As John has said again the turbo you want for your budget is a HX40.I would strongly reccomend you have it pinned to ensure longevity and your piece of mind.Rammin On has been thrashing on hisPDR HX40 now for about 5-6 years and his ride does around 500 to the ground.And trust me when I say keith does not let Casper rest as he is always on the throttle.
On exhausts...
One my 98 when it was a custom HX35 I ran a 4inch and loved the sound.It wasn't until I got a good buy on a 5" that I changed it over.I called the resident HP and forgot more than I will ever learn Cummins guru Rammin On out in his shop in Missouri about the step up.His exact words were WHY and that I would loose HP and raise the torque number as the exhaust would cool inside the pipe instead of flowing out.I laughed and amde a bet with him and promptly lost too.With no other changes in my truck I went back to the jet and lost 13hp and gained about 100 ft lbs of torque due to the bigger exhaust.Called Keith back and ate crow and still owe him a steak when I go visit sometime.4inch is all you need and as JP has said contact MBRP as their kits are very reasonably priced.If you want I know a guy out here who also stocks them and can sell you and ship one........Andy
11-08-2007 | 03:48 PM
#15
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 621
Likes: 0
From: Fort St. John B.C. Canada
What would be wrong with my 98 12v? I have 370's, the PDR HX40, the 3k GSK, 191 dv and a #10 plate and my egt's are out of control. Insanely high EGT's. Not a word of a lie, when I floor my truck I can go from 700 f to a pegged 1500 degree pyro in around 3 seconds. The pyro needle move just about as fast as my boost gauge. My HX40 has never seen more than 40 psi. It seems to be wastegated @ 38 psi.
John.
John.