Jim Fulmer

MADDOG's plate isn't full forward, his pump and mine are the same, more rack does not make more power on our pumps.

Jim

98rammer

[quote author=Jim Fulmer link=board=7;threadid=23694;start=15#msg226028 date=1071785741]
MADDOG's plate isn't full forward, his pump and mine are the same, more rack does not make more power on our pumps.

Jim
[/quote]


nope, but he has large enough twins and the right injectors to burn that fuel right? (he has enough air). is air the limiting factor on your hp compared to richard's or has he just set it up differently (timing, twins, injectors, etc.) for whatever purpose?

full rack travel allows the fuel to enter the combustion chamber a little late in the cycle. to burn that fuel, you need to have enough air (which, as J.R. says, most "street" trucks don't have enough). how do you get more air? how do you get more air so that more/full rack travel works? more boost pressure? bigger/better intercooling considering density of the air is what's most important (in relation to boost)?
just from one perspective- if you've got big injectors and twin turbos that make 600hp, how do you go about making more (say, you have EDM injectors for best atomization, timing for the best fuel curve, etc.)? and again--how do you get more air?

ok, that's enough thinking tonight ;D

Tom

MCummings

Tom,

Richard's twins will not provide enough air at full rack travel. his plate is limiting him with less rack travel. He even has the AFC installed and working properly. He is a classic case pointing out that smoke does not make HP.

Even though I am running 100+PSI boost, I still don't have enough air to burn all my fuel at full rack travel.

Tuning, tuning, and more tuning.
A 24V takes a Box, Injectors, and Lots of air.
A 12V needs the rack adjusted, the AFC adjusted, the timing set, the proper DV's, and injectors that aren't too small, or too big for your specific pump.

Merrick

J.R. Adkins

Jim try taking your big turbo and putting it on the manifold,, then mount a charger TWICE that size to feed it.

I posted a picture above and will leave it there for just a minute so that you can see what a BIG set of twins are.

Don M

I run 8mm of rack travel currently. Not 15, 18, 19 ,21 or whatever.

JR,

those are some big turbos. LOL!! Makes my little single look worthless.

Don~

J.R. Adkins

What turbos???? I dont make any power.....

J.R. Adkins

[quote author=Don M link=board=7;threadid=23694;start=15#msg226188 date=1071802591]
I run 8mm of rack travel currently. Not 15, 18, 19 ,21 or whatever.

JR,

those are some big turbos. LOL!! Makes my little single look worthless.

Don~
[/quote]

The B-1 series turbos are very good for the street but are not able to support upper HP levels in the Scheid area.

Don your turbo prolly works well for you. I ran some of the same ones as you and they were good at that time. I just have this addiction that i just cant satisfy DIESEL baby.......gotta love the power!!!

J.R.

98rammer

[quote author=MCummings link=board=7;threadid=23694;start=15#msg226174 date=1071800897]Richard's twins will not provide enough air at full rack travel. his plate is limiting him with less rack travel. He even has the AFC installed and working properly. He is a classic case pointing out that smoke does not make HP.
[/quote]

yeah, but what set up does allow you to burn that extra fuel?(just referencing to earlier posts...) richards truck's truck doesn't smoke that much for the power it makes.

plus is more boost pressure better? to a point, but air density is most important. so would better aftercooling with more boost allow a set up to burn the fuel associated with FULL rack travel? will the hp increase?

btw, i wish more people would understand that smoke doesn't equal power. of course you need to be rich, but once you've made a cloud of smoke, that's it. spool up wont increase, and will actually put the fire out with too much fuel. obviously a lot of set ups use that fuel to build the boost quick after 10-20psi, but that bottom end wont get any better.

btw, and not to start an arguement, but i'm still questioning delivery valves. 40hp more? 0hp more? joe d's making the power with 181's while most others use 191's or custom. i dunno???

Don, why do you run 8mm of rack travel? injectors support the fuel i presume?

Tom

Jim Fulmer

Hey you guys stop picking on me or I'm going to cry.....I don't have any turbo's now :'(

So if what your saying is true then with my plate directly in the middle I have allot of room to play with the new Twins, I'm not going to build some crazy sled pulling Twins, I still drive my truck (didn't see the pic J.R.) but I do have a PDR 40 and suppose to have a Big Brother from the late Nowell Thomas so we'll see if I can get all this together in Jan. when I get back and do some testing!

Jim

gunracer1

allright we are getting some real tech going here.

Jim Fulmer

Back to data that's what I will have, I've got a few things planned right now but first will be the Twins, I'll have temp probes to measure at the hat and between the stages, also I'll be measuring the boost of the Big Turbo(between stages). Once the turbo's have some miles on them and road tests are done I'll go to the dyno and play, after that is all done I hope to have the new intercooler to try out! BOTW a 40/ Big Brother setup has already been at 95 PSI.

Jim

J.R. Adkins

[quote author=Jim Fulmer link=board=7;threadid=23694;start=15#msg226369 date=1071848312]
Back to data that's what I will have, BOTW a 40/ Big Brother setup has already been at 95 PSI.

Jim
[/quote]


Jim you have a Data Aquc system?? I have one coming very soon. Complete set up with tons of sensors. DATA DATA DATA!!!!

I wonder how well the hx40/Big brother would do at 160 psi??

J.R.

Jim Fulmer

No data system just guages, a data system is nice and I'd like to have one but there to expensive and I have way to much planned out right now, as for the boost number why would I try to do that to my daily driver, it probably wouldn't last a month. I like my 500 valet HP that I can drive across the country, just need to be freshened up! I'll leave that crazy stuff to the sled pulling bunch.

Jim

1dslram

Jim and JR are right Smoke is not H.P. I tried that at MM last year and produced less H.P. when I increased the fuel. 502 on the first day and 476 on the second after I added more fuel and all else the same. At the present my plate is the Piers custom plate in the middle where he set it on the flow machine. I have used plates from stock too #8, #4, #10 and a stock 215 plate.
Bruce

Don M

I run a stock 215 plate. 8mm of rack travel max as of now.

If I ever get off of work I am going to finally tune the truck and build ME some injectors. I guess I am like the guy that is an auto glass repair tech that has a cracked windshield or the auto body guy that has a car full of dents. NO time to build myself any injectors either. Maybe this SundayI will start. Take advantage of the cooler winter weather and make some HP. 8)

Back to the rack travel: As the plunger is sliding up the barrel, once it covers the spill port, the injection event begins to take place. More rack travel only adds to the time the event takes place. In many cases the event is extended so late the fuel really does not add to the combustion pressure you would hope to get. It just burns incompletely and can add containmination on the next intake stroke. A loss of VE.

Adding to this; the work it takes to pump that fuel with the additional rack travel only takes away from the HP "bottom line" in parasitic loss.

So far I just need 8mm of rack to make 620HP on a single turbo. I bet with some time and care I can make close to 700 with the same medium sized single.

Don~