chipmonk

so multi-billion dollar companies like shell and chevron bought these refineries for millions of $$$, and did not know about the taxes and regulations before they pulled out their checkbooks? they bought these refineries and almost immediately closed them down, with their crude suppliers testifying that they had at least a 20-30 year supply of crude that they could supply them with. i could understand if they had owned these refineries for years, and Ca suddenly changed the rules on them, but they just bought them and closed them down- this is one situation where blaming the gov't just doesn't work.

Bark

MMMMmmphhtt-- Had to put a sock in my mouth to keep from ranting. Good points from everyone. Frustrating because all us little people can really do is be irritated. Gonna have to stay away from this thread to keep my BP down.
Though I have to say, its been nice to be able to discuss things with you people without getting into “meet you on the street—jerk” exchanges.

capt.Ron

I'd love to, "Meet You on the street!"
That way you could take me fishin or just exploring Alaska!!

capt.Ron

Doh!!
Didn't pay complete attention to what you posted.
Did they sell off the equipment? Or move it?
It could have just been a case of buying out the competition.
A lot of companies do this. It's perfectly legal to do so.
I own a home health care agency we've been going a couple of yrs and have received letters about a possible buy out. They don't want to own us they just want to pay us to go away. Ain't happening! Not unless each partner gets a couple of million each!

RickG

See my post in the fuels topics about the best article I've read on diesel prices . The more diesel vehicles are produced the more the price of diesel will go up . The economic advantage of diesel over gas is regularly decreasing due to higher cost of diesel over gas and added costs of DPF's .
I've really surprised there are not more commuters looking into carpooling options which would greatly reduce consumption and pollution . http://www.mountvernonnews.com/local...arpooling.html

Hannibal

There is no shortage of crude or refined fuel. Some would like you to believe there is as an excuse for the high cost of gas and diesel and most actually believe it. It's business in a free market pure and simple. Environmentalists are just an easy scapegoat. There are plenty of capitalists living along the coast in their McMansions that don't want it in their back yards either. The only shortage we're experiencing is self induced by OPEC and big oil. OPEC has limited supply in order to artificially shore up demand keeping the prices for crude high ensuring high profits. On the home front, refiners experiencing lower demand due to prices at that pump and in return have cut back on supply in order to shore up high prices and ensure profits. Without government intervention, this is how business works. If we were to tap into ANWAR or new found huge reserves, it would not be in the best interest of big oil to invest billions in new drilling only to sell the finished product at a reduced price. Higher overhead for lower profit isn't how successful businesses work. Any new crude would go onto the world market and would likewise be limited to ensure profits. To believe otherwise in my humble opinion would be naive and full of wishful thinking.
This reminds me of a few years ago, our local utilities encouraged us to use less water with restrictions and fear tactics of shortages and drying up wells. So we cut our water consumption almost in half. In return, the water utility raised our water and sewer rates double and developers were granted building permits like hot dogs at a ball game for new condos and subdivisions. Same tactic, different liquid.
In a free market capitalistic society, we are at the mercy of the capitalists. Dog eat dog... Sometimes you get what you wish for.

HOHN

Indeed. Capitalism works best-- but saving it from itself it the trick. Competition is great, but sometimes somebody wins-- then what?

Hannibal

Somebody loses... If it ain't you, life is good!

chipmonk

that's exactly what they did, and the ftc found that they did not violate any laws. but what it did was ensure that they could control the amount of refined oil on the market, and could continue to blame the gov't and the environmentalists for the limited number of refineries- all while running to the bank with record breaking profits.

chipmonk

excellent point- i think if drilling takes place in anwar, there will be an initial drop in prices at the pump, followed by the same old semi-daily price increases, that we are currently seeing. maybe they'll claim that the caribou are very shrewd, and 'eating up' all of their profits.