jlipskoc

We'll with all the recent ice storms in the midwest, I lucked out and never lost power, we got 1/4 inch of ice, 2 inches of sleet, but many family and friends still don't have any power. There are people at my work that still don't have power now, going on two weeks.

I'm looking into a pto generator or natural gas tri fuel generator to run our home.

I saw this custom made gen on on Eb-y, using a head and pto gear box with some belts and was wondering if I could make my own.

What do you guys think, is this a reliable setup given belts are involved?

Zach

I think it could be reliable. You would have to be able to see the sine wave of the power generated or some other way to know when you have achieved 60hz based on the rpm of the tractor. Once you know that you have to worry about loading the generator to a point where you reduce rpms on the tractor.

jlipskoc

Thanks, I see what your saying. The most I plan on running at any one point in time, is a fridge, freezer, and furnace. Maybe a stove top for cooking meals, and some occasional lights use at night. The main thing is keeping the house heated, blower on the furnace running. (we have ng) During the summer would be nice to have the air conditioner running. I would think 10kw is enough to power the air cond.

According to the ad, hes using a reducer gear box, so instead of running 540rpm, it runs at 320 rpm on the pto. Thus saving fuel and wear/tear. Sounded like a neat idea.

surfram

I really like the standby generators that have their own computer and auto transfer switch. They run off propane or natural gas and look like a big AC unit. They are totally automatic and even run weekly checkups on themselves. Generac and Kohler make them.

jrs_dodge_diesel

We have two of those gas generators, 12 kW Kohlers. I would not even waste my money on one. We use them as remote radio tower backup when the power goes out. One of the generators had the stator windings short out with less than 50 operating hours on the unit. The other unit had a battery explosion (charging voltage and amps are too high for float charging). Both units are complete fuel hogs. they are hooked to a 425 gallon propane tank, which it will burn through in 12-14 days. They are air cooled engines too so you have to keep an eye on the oil level to avoid the low oil shutdown. Thier liquid cooled counterparts don't have the oil problem, but are far worse on fuel consumption, it will burn the 425 tank in 4-6 days.

IMHO, don't waste your money. You will be much happier with a good small diesel genset, or a gear driven tractor PTO genset if you have a tractor.

jlipskoc

I'm not gonna even waste my time/money on a gas versions, no way to stock fuel, more hazardous. Its diesel/pto/ng for me.

Heres a pretty good link on the pros/cons on fuel types.

I like the idea of natural gas model, unlimited supply, and I'd really like to get liquid cooled one.

I've heard to find a model that runs 1800rpm, instead of the industry standard 3600 rpm?

Gen FAQ:
http://www.penlight.org/pages/faq_pg...ator_faqs.html

spitfire9137

Less rpms= less noise, wear and fuel consumption.

74dart

When Florida got hit with the Hurricanes a few years ago there was this guy who got plans off the internet for a reverse dyno genrator setup and built one. Then he drove his TDI Jetta on it and set the cruse to 35 and powered his house. He said the plans had a chart that told you what speed to run to get what KWs. He powered his house for 2 weeks on less than a tank of diesel.

Micaiahfied

74 dart... now i like that idea. and with a jetta he's got a very fuel efficient setup, my question would be, for the mone it would take to build something like that are there other (maybe more portable) options that make more sence? i'd love some more info on it!

BC847

I'd be interested in how many of these have been sold and what the users had to say.



- - - > In My Opinion < - - -


The problem I see with it is the gearbox appears to me to be incorrectly applied. Being that it's of the type that has the input at 90* to the output (don't know the correct name), and considering there's some reduction/increasing of shaft speed . . . . . that will not last.

If I'm seeing the gearbox correctly, it's hooked-up backward to start with. Unless I'm mistaken, the shaft that has the pulley on it is actually the input shaft and has a worm type of gear on it. The other splined shaft is actually the output and has a standard gear on it. Most likely the two are of the hypoid design. The comment that you don't have to run the input at the common 540 rpm to get 1800rpm to the alternator is a big hint in my book.

In this application, the splined shaft's gear has to force the worm gear into motion and will present with severe loading thus not lasting long . . .. at all. It'd be kinda like installing and running a typical automotive rear-end backward (power into the axles with the load on the driveshaft).


Personally, I'd shy away from it.

Hope my description makes sense.


EDIT ~ That gearbox is called an Indirect drive right angle speed reducer. The power input is to the pulley shaft with the load on the splined shaft.
Here are typical examples of such ~ http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/wwg...Speed+Reducers

Raspy

There is really no good reason to go with that setup when you can get a regular PTO generator that would have the same or similar generator with a gearbox mounted directly on it. Belts add complication, rob power, and can slip under heavy load if not set up right. This means a variation in cycles that may be hard to dial out of the system. The gearbox systems are simple and enclosed with no belt, and geared correctly to run on a 540 RPM standard PTO output shaft with a driveline. They can be mounted permanently where you back up to them or on a trailer that you can tow around. They are quite common and proven. An 11,000 Watt genny runs on about 24 PTO HP

As far as getting 60 cycles out of them you set the tractor at it's PTO RPM which will be close enough for many applications, and check the output with a hertz meter for more precise 60 cycle operation. Many Fluke volt ohm meters have a hertz counter on them. You simply put the probes on the output with a medium load on the generator and it will tell you where you are. Then adjust the speed slightly if needed. 59-61 cycles will be fine for most sensitive things. Electric lights, electric stoves, heaters, power tools and welders can be way off. Battery chargers put out more at a higher frequency so you can "hot rod" chargers by running them at about 62 or 65 cycles.

One of the great things about PTO generators is that they require no maintenance when not used. Unlike gasoline generators that must be run regularly or forget about it during an emergency. Diesel gennys are great to, but you have to buy a diesel engine as part of the deal, so the cost is high and they are less portable. If you have a tractor, the PTO generator is a great choice.

Wetspirit

Raspy

One more point.

As BC847 pointed out, that gearbox looks like a worm gear setup. Which means it cannot be driven from the output shaft (as shown) or it will, at least, be way less efficient than a straight cut or hellical gear set. The regular gear boxes on PTO generators do not have a 90 degree angle and are MUCH more efficient. Any PTO generator gear must raise the RPM from 540 (standard tractor PTO speed) to either 1800 or 3600 (standard Generator speed for 60 cycle output), depending on the generator configuration. No need to re-invent the wheel here and that gearbox looks like it is designed for a different application where the power comes in on the other shaft. A gear reduction instead of a gear increase. Be careful!

Wetspirit

BC847

He also claims that set-up will provide rated power with only 16HP input. http://cgi.ebay.com/10KW-PTO-GENERAT...em110080693061

Cow pies!

That alternator is specified to have a minimum of 20HP to achieve rated output. http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=45416 (Apparently an import by Harbor Freight).

Who knows what additional HP is required to push through that gearing set-up. I'd bet that gear box runs VERY hot at continuous rated output. Most likely not for long.

Get a real PTO genset and be done with it. 540 standard PTO input spinning an 1800RPM 4-pole head. Nice and beefy.

jlipskoc

Thanks for the info, looks like I'll just bypass this whole belt idea.

BC, Is that your tractor/gen setup?

Isn't there a 'torque' involved when running it, unless you bolted that peice to the floor.

When you do run it, I'm guessing you have a detached garage? and leave the doors open.

Are you concerned with someone stealing your tractor while its running? or do you live in the country.

How big is that unit in the picture, how much hp is your tractor and what kind of fuel consumption /hr do you use?

What about air flow, i notice you don't have much air space to the rear of it, which way does the air flow go.

One of my concerns is getting the tractor/pto combo positioned to the rear of the house during bad weather, now we have 4 inches of solid sleet/ice on the ground and its near impossible to walk on, and as I can't leave it outside if it the rain/snow due to getting the gen head wet.

74dart

The guy that built called Car Talk and was tellling them about it.