dieselminded

Ive asked a few questions to the powermaster and the feedback has been over whelming check this question out about fuel pumps they really aim to please.------------------------------Details:


This question concerns 2002 24 valve cummins. The application is being used in a dodge

I Talked to previous cummins owners and most agree that i need to put a electronic fuel pump on my truck to help my factory fuel pump if not my factory fuel pump will burn up because its working to hard to get fuel to the engine. Is this true? Would adding an extra fuel pump hurt any thing? --------------------------------------------------------------Summary: Fuel Pump

Solution:

Thanks for your Email message.

You do not need another pump.

We changed the engine and fuel system in 2003 Dodge trucks. The main reason for the changes in fuel system design is to meet new EPA standards.

You can't just believe or accept as true everything you read in TDR and think it is going to happen to you. Yes, there have been failures of the lift pumps and VP44 injection pumps. The numbers are not nearly as great as what you are lead to believe.

The ECM on the engine tells the lift pump when to run and how much to pump. The 10 psi number you are talking about may be what that the ECM is calling for at times. The lift pump mainly supplies fuel flow to the VP44 and not so much pressure, but volume is dependent on pressure - so if there's some pressure the lubrication will be adequate. Power and emissions compliance could be another matter, but we're talking about VP-44 health here. Cummins and Bosch do not design our systems for off-spec compliance.

The Bosch VP44 electronic fuel pump has higher injection pressures, electronic controlled timing and fueling which allows precise, instantaneous control and provides greater responsiveness over the entire power range (extended from 2700 to 3200 rpm). This was a completely new engine design platform in 1998 that combined electronic engine controls with high-pressure injection as well as high strength engine componentry. The 24 valve design with cylinder centered fuel injection improves combustion efficiency which results in better emissions, fuel economy and performance.

Although the VP44 was initially not as reliable as we would have liked, Cummins and BOSCH are confident in its reliability today. The VP44 is much less complicated internally than the P7100, and it has many fewer finely machined parts. We don't know for sure that BOSCH considered low-sulfur fuel when designing the pump, since the pump is fuel lubricated and today's fuels are low-sulfur.

The VP44 is completely fuel lubricated, as the VE pump is. It does not use oil lubrication like the P7100 does. The VP44 is expected to last at least a long as the P7100 in normal automotive applications. However, we obviously have much more "long-term" experience with the P7100 than we do with the VP44, so our knowledge base is still evolving. Soon after launch, the VP44 had its share of problems, just as the P7100 did when it was introduced, but we have worked closely with BOSCH to correct the issues with the pump, and we're confident that the VP44 will be a reliable fuel pump.

Fuels with low lubricity can cause increased wear or seizure of the VP44 fuel pump internal components. If you are not sure of the fuel you use add a lubricity additive is required.

The electronic controls on the 24-valve engine allow Cummins to control the power and torque very precisely across the entire RPM range. The mechanically controlled engines have their power and torque precisely controlled at torque peak and rated power RPMs, but between those two engine speeds, power and torque can often exceed the published figures.

Just keep using good fuel filters(Fleetguard or Dodge).

Than you for your interest in Cummins products. Please let us know if you need assistance in locating the nearest Cummins-authorized Dealer or Distributor Service Provider. For assistance in locating a Service Provider, feel free to use Cummins North America Dealer Locator, which can be found on Cummins website:
http://www.cummins.com/service_locator/index.cfm

Please let us know if you have other questions and if away from your computer or have a time-critical request that needs more urgent attention, feel free to call us toll-free (from North America) at 1-800-DIESELS (343-7357).

Email direct: powermaster@cummins.com

Regards,
--
Powermaster
Customer Assistance Center
Cummins, Inc.
Columbus, Indiana, USA

graphitecumnz

what did you expect them to say??

dieselminded

Have u heard of people useing electronic fuel pumps?

graphitecumnz

the stock lift/fuel pump on the 24 V is electric...

I use FASS on my truck and bypass the stock lift pump.

dieselminded

whats a fass? and why did you put it on?

graphitecumnz

FASS is fuel air separation system. It's a high flow fuel pump, water separator and fuel filter placed by the tank... the web site is dieselpp.com.

I put it on because for me it was the easiest way to bypass the stock lift pump and alleviate the mounting reservation I had about BOMBing my truck. I run almost a constant 15 psi of fp... under WOT I can pull it down to 14-14.5 psi... it is a pricey unit so beware...

Cummins and Dodge will stand by their product regardless of how many pumps they replace. There are more than a fair share of folks on DTR, TDR, and DTW that have had lift pumps and VP-44's replaced under warranty, out of pocket at a dealer, or in a garage with friends and beers.... There are probably more than that currently running an "aftermarket" fueling system to bypass or supplement the stock lift pump.

dieselminded

ill check it out thanks

Shovelhead

I've been using the stock pump in the stock location.
My 1st pump died @ 32,000 miles, my 2nd is still going strong @ 67,000 miles.
The main point to remember is that with the '98-'02 VP pumped trucks you need to install a fuel pressure gauge to watch for the tell-tale signs of a failing lift pump.

Ed

Dieseldude4x4

I, on the other hand, chunked that stock garbage after number four went out (last on in Lynchburg in November along the road on a 28 degree morning) and installed the FASS too. Don't have any miles on it yet but time will tell. Can't be much worse than that stock garbage.
Hey Ed, I got a couple LP's lying around if you need a spare. I think number five is still in the tool box since I got home from Keith's place.

dieselminded

Ok I get the point .......but didnt their reply sounded good Ill wait till mine goes I dont see how having a gauge will do any thing...............Well lets see here it looks like im losing fuel presure I better get a new pump....................If your pump was screwed up wouldnt you be able to tell anyway?

infidel

No. The VP will suck fuel even if the lift pump isn't working at all, truck will run fine. Problem is it won't suck enough extra fuel to provide cooling and will rapidly wear the VP.

First problem you'll have is dead VP or inability to prime the fuel filter after a change.

You really need a FP gauge to be on the safe side

Shovelhead

Unfortunately ,
If the lift pump dies, the VP might be able to suck enough fuel to keep the engine running.
However, the lift pump provides enough fuel to run the engine plus provides an excess of fuel which cools the VP injection pump (returning the excess to the fuel tank to cycle through again).
So running with a dead $150 lift pump might cause a failure of the more expen$ive injection pump.

edit: Bill Types faster Than I Do.............

waynem

Where does that fuel pressure guage hook up to ??
What size guage do you need ??