Steven C

Chevrolet says when the light for the clean the exhaust filter comes on you need to get the truck up to 30 mph for 20 minutes to clean the exhaust filter before the duramax goes into reduced power mode, or you need to get it in for service then. And by the way, idling is bad for the filter too. It would sound like that would be a worry in rush hour traffic. Pulling into a wayside to take a nap on a long trip could be trouble as well. Is the Cummins & Powerstroke going to have these problems too? Performance upgrades is going to be tough in the future as well. I realize this emission thing is new & we have a lot to learn. Ant thoughts on this? Thanks, Steven C.

Admin edit to correct spelling........Ed

phox_mulder

Cummins.

No G.

No idea what this particulate filter is you speak of, but I'm guessing it's in those new fangled Diesel engines.


phox

Shovelhead

Welcome to the site.

Interesting question.
I'm sure the new "Clean Air" laws will change the way we think of, and work on the Newer Generation of Diesel Engines.

We'll all be on the same learning curve.

1-2-3

The price of my 99 just went up, when I decide to sell it, which may be awhile. Lets keep the feds going. Each new law adds value to all the "older" rigs.

Monty

Here is a link to my thread explaining the DPF and regen.

https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...d.php?t=131022
All OEM's will have an active and stationary regen. The active will be going down the road were EGT's are high enough to burn the soot into ash. The other stage of an active is were the ECM commands the injectors when the exhaust valve is open to squirt a fine mist of diesel into the DPF in order to raise the EGT temps in order to burn the soot into ash.

The stationary is more of a complete burn than an active. Some take from 15-45minutes for a stationary. The bigger Cummins engines, CAT, MB and Detroit all have to be stationary with park brake set for a stationary to occur. It will automatically raise RPM and start the regen process.

westcoaster

I really wonder how burning more and more fuel makes less pollution.
No wonder why the price of fuel is through the roof...

RickG

ALL diesels manufactured after this first of this year and sold in the U.S. require particulate filters . The ones on the class 8 trucks are supposed to go over 100,000 miles before requiring servicing . Some shops will offer an exchange rather than requiring waiting for the one off the truck to be cleaned . Only time will tell what will happen with the smaller vehicles . The exchange sounds like a good idea . Change it yourself to avoid high service fees . The trick is to be sure it needs replacement and be able to verify the quality of the relacement part.

SoTexRattler

My boss, a dyed-in-the-wool Ford guy, bought one of the first 2008's with the 6.4 engine in it about 2 wks ago. (Nice looking truck but OMG the price!!!$52K)
He says it has plenty power but crappier mileage compared to his 2007 and older Fords(2006,2005,2004,'03,02,01... well you get the idea )
The first week of driving it he made a very high speed run (~95) for abt 15miles back into town and upon getting into town and stop&go city traffic, it went into DPF regen mode. He said it scared the crud out of him as he thought he had blown that brand-new engine when it started really pumping out a LOT of white smoke as he moved along in city traffic. It turned out it wasn't unburned fuel, but apparently white ash and smoke from the DPF regen process... The truck engine didn't act any different and stopped smoking abruptly as it started...
He says hasn't gotten anything better than the 12's for MPGs yet.
Sure makes me feel good about my old Cummins...

On another new diesel emissions note, my Brother-in-law JUST bought a brand spanking new Mercedes E class sedan with the BLUETEC diesel.. That is an amazing vehicle to drive! Gobs of silent diesel power!
He was telling me about the demo they perform to show how few nasties come out the tailpipe of the new BlueTec engines. He said they take a bagle and stuff it into the tailpipe with the engine running and use the engine exhaust to heat the bagle up.
Then they EAT the bagle to demonstrate that Bluetec doesn't have anything more noxious than watervapor coming out the tailpipe to affect the flavor of the bagle!!!
We looked at the actual BlueTec engine under the big sound deadening engine cover. That engine is SO tightly packed together under there that it's hard to concieve how anybody can get their fingers much less their hands into the external engine hardware.. I could locate the BOSCH CR pump on the drivers side of the engine at what looks like the front end of an overhead cam engine(?) We could find the two HP CR manifolds and the HP injector lines disappearing below the engine's surface. The Turbo was just visible nestled between the V at the top-rear of the engine.
That has to be the quietest diesel engine I've ever listened to. Only as it is cranking up can you tell it has a little bit of a "diesel" sound to it.. Imagine that painful, tooth-gnashing Ford 6.0 "CRRRRRRAAAAAKK" sound, but oh so much more genteel and refined ..

Just think... The Mercedes was only about $14K or so more than the Ford 6.4 truck.

K.

belgianmagic

THIS IS WHAT ANNOYS ME ABOUT OUR WONDERFUL COUNTRY THAT I LOVE SO DEARLY ... WE here in America, are going to save the world with cleaner exhaust... while china opens a new COAL FIRED POWER PLANT EVERY WEEK,...EVERY WEEK... GRRRrr

I saw these shows on PBS... all the coal fired steel plants and power plants they cant even see across their river and we gotta have this...

thats it I'M MOVIN TO CHINA !

RickG

Same engine , more fun http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2...drive_in_.html .

infidel

This may be true but my understanding is that China's diesel emissions laws are tougher than the US. In fact some cities have banned older diesel engines that don't have modern emissions controls.

TXTad

I don't know if this is true or not, but it wouldn't surprise me. One thing they sure can do in a totalitarian state is make sweeping changes that go into effect abruptly without a concern for anyone's opinion of it.

kycatpower

True fact - by 2010 the HD over-the-road trucks will be "CLEANING" the air we breathe.

DPF's - Just sat through a presentation on these at work today (Cat dealership). They look very much like a catalytic converter (though larger) inside and out. I'll try to hit the high points here (and apologize ahead of time for the long post).

DPF (passive) regeneration - this is an active computer controlled process that requires no input from the driver. Sensors in the DPF measure the restriction or build-up of particulate matter. When required (varies by engine condition, operation & load, fuel sulfur, oil consumption, oil ash content, etc) a small amount of raw diesel fuel is injected into the carbon-ceramic honeycomb to burn off the particulates. Sitting at an idle, this will happen VERY often. Pulling 16K up a mountain it will probably never kick in. Basically, the actual honey-comb must be >500 degrees F to properly operate.

DPF Service - the EPA is "requiring" a minimum 150K between services. This is a manual process where the honey-comb is physically removed and cleaned. The machine to perform this service is estimated to cost 20 to 40 THOUSAND dollars. (The carbon-honeycomb is delicate - I doubt a shop-vac will work and you wil probably destroy the DPF.) The EPA is also "mandating" a 435K / 10-year life for the DPF element.

The idea is that your dealer will see the truck on or before 150K for the emmisions servicing. They may choose to remove/clean/install your filter, or they may simply keep a number of clean "swap" filters to expedite your trip. The emmisions technology will be tied back into the truck computer. Remove the DPF (or it's element) and you will likely be shoved into a "limp" mode with very attractive check engine, emmisions failure, etc lights lit up on the dash.

It is way too early to declare the death of performance upgrades. The gas side predicted this several years ago when OBD was on the way and needless to say they were wrong. At the same time - it will be difficult to install stacks when you cannot legally remove a 3' long 18" round can that is wired into your trucks computer (size made up by me). Trying to add a larger exhaust system may require the purchase of a larger DPF. Advanced computer combustion monitoring and tuning may make it difficult, expensive, or impossible to add larger injectors, twins, fuel boxes, etc. I have faith that someone will find a way to make 2007+ trucks faster and more powerful. How much? Only time will tell.

PS - if you are concerned about the above facts, get (or keep) your truck now because the 2010 requirements will make things VERY interesting.

TOMTOM

They dont care how mutch fuel we burn. I'ts how clean it burns.
Makes no sense to me either.
TOMMY

MikeyB

The Chinese has adopted the Tier 3 diesel emissions. But they still have plenty of old commie built trucks belching black smoke.

MikeyB