New HTT 64/71/13 at the Track
07-12-2007, 10:57 AM
#31
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I tried clamping the hose with a big pair of vise grips (don't have any smaller ones with the flat jaws) but it didn't seem to make much difference on the highway at 70mph. Still saw the same low boost and high EGT's.
I didn't really get on it to check the spool up because it's so smoky it's embarrassing in town. Combined with the poor air quality and haze we're currently having, I've found it's a very effective way to make lots of new enemies.
Not sure why I didn't think to try the vise grips again at the track yesterday.
Guess I was just so disappointed I wasn't thinking straight. 
The truck does feel much stronger once it's spooled though. I'll be a little upset if I have to remove the whole turbo to change a bad actuator. Aren't they usually tested before going out?
I didn't really get on it to check the spool up because it's so smoky it's embarrassing in town. Combined with the poor air quality and haze we're currently having, I've found it's a very effective way to make lots of new enemies.
Not sure why I didn't think to try the vise grips again at the track yesterday.
Guess I was just so disappointed I wasn't thinking straight. The truck does feel much stronger once it's spooled though. I'll be a little upset if I have to remove the whole turbo to change a bad actuator. Aren't they usually tested before going out?
07-12-2007, 11:55 AM
#32
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It really sounds like you have a wastegate that is opening early....clamp the hose and then lash the wastegate arm closed. If you don't make 40psi then check your boost lines from the turbo to the intake manifold....I had one slip off slightly....got to 20psi and the truck fell flat....finally it moved enough I could hear a whistle. If you can't make 40psi with the wastegate clamped and the cool air supply lines checked then you have a fueling issue or a lame that may or may not improve with age. Keep trying...that turbo should rock. ks
07-12-2007, 12:15 PM
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This is unbelievable. Last time out with the stock turbo and beta 4.4 I ran a 13.86. Today with the new turbo and 4.4 I ran a best of 16.49 @ 94.54mph with a 3.092 60'. 
Some other runs...
Beta 4.4 #9
16.86 @ 94.14mph
3.249 60'
Max Boost = 33psi
Max EGT = 1580
Wild #9
15.82 @ ?
2.794 60'
Max Boost = 33psi
Max EGT = 1640
Wild #8 Stacked w/Quad XZT
15.54 @ 95.93mph
2.783 60'
Max Boost = 34psi
Max EGT = 1645
So I guess I do have a serious spooling issue. The highest I could get the boost while staging was 4psi. That was with the pedal all the way to the floor. I ran all runs in 2wd since tire spin was not a problem. The ambient temp was about 15-20* hotter today than my last runs. I assume that difference would contribute about 50-60* to the max EGT's. It still isn't cooling much better than the stocker which was hitting 1583 on most runs with 4.4.
Looks like my options are:
1) Talk to HTT and hope it's just a bad actuator or something (wishful thinking).
2) Get more fuel....somehow.
3) Go back to the stock turbo and add water injection to keep temps down.
I have plans to get injectors and a stage II CP3, but I'm in the process of moving and can't really deal with having the truck down during the next month or two. At this point though, I really don't feel like doing another turbo swap and installing water injection.
Any ideas on boxes/programmers/stacks that might give better spool-up? I have a BD w/Scary Larry coming, but not sure if that's gonna help much.
Some other runs...
Beta 4.4 #9
16.86 @ 94.14mph
3.249 60'
Max Boost = 33psi
Max EGT = 1580
Wild #9
15.82 @ ?
2.794 60'
Max Boost = 33psi
Max EGT = 1640
Wild #8 Stacked w/Quad XZT
15.54 @ 95.93mph
2.783 60'
Max Boost = 34psi
Max EGT = 1645
So I guess I do have a serious spooling issue. The highest I could get the boost while staging was 4psi. That was with the pedal all the way to the floor. I ran all runs in 2wd since tire spin was not a problem. The ambient temp was about 15-20* hotter today than my last runs. I assume that difference would contribute about 50-60* to the max EGT's. It still isn't cooling much better than the stocker which was hitting 1583 on most runs with 4.4.
Looks like my options are:
1) Talk to HTT and hope it's just a bad actuator or something (wishful thinking
).2) Get more fuel....somehow.
3) Go back to the stock turbo and add water injection to keep temps down.
I have plans to get injectors and a stage II CP3, but I'm in the process of moving and can't really deal with having the truck down during the next month or two. At this point though, I really don't feel like doing another turbo swap and installing water injection.
Any ideas on boxes/programmers/stacks that might give better spool-up? I have a BD w/Scary Larry coming, but not sure if that's gonna help much.
07-12-2007, 12:53 PM
#34
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Gave HTT a call and spoke to Dave. He seems to think it's programming related and/or a lack of fuel on the bottom end. He said it could also have something to do with how the timing is controlled down low. He didn't seem to think there was anything wrong with the turbo, just a lack of drive pressure to spin the bigger turbine wheel.
I feel kinda stupid because he initially tried to talk me into the smaller wheel. It seems like everyone goes with the 71mm wheel and with my planned upgrades I didn't want to outgrow the smaller one and have high drive pressure issues in the future. I just had no idea the larger wheel would not peform at all with my current setup. Dave offered to swap the turbine wheels if I want to go that route, which I thought was pretty cool of him to do. I would still like to try some different programming first and see how it does.
I feel kinda stupid because he initially tried to talk me into the smaller wheel. It seems like everyone goes with the 71mm wheel and with my planned upgrades I didn't want to outgrow the smaller one and have high drive pressure issues in the future. I just had no idea the larger wheel would not peform at all with my current setup. Dave offered to swap the turbine wheels if I want to go that route, which I thought was pretty cool of him to do. I would still like to try some different programming first and see how it does.
07-12-2007, 01:21 PM
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I don't get it!!!???
You guys are ruining my whole day/month/ life. I read nothing but good posts about that turbo and Nathan just built me a new set of custom twins that should be delivered tomorrow and that turbo is my new small one for this setup. I know he's built at least 3 or 4 other sets with that turbo in the mix and NO such problems as some of you are describing. I've got to wonder if it's the exh manifold,.. or length of mounting bolts or whatever that is the culprit here. I recall when the SS first came out that a few of the guys had gone with this turbo for better spoolup and the ability to move a ton of air and I read nothing but good stuff. I sure hope I can report back that something is wrong with your setup other than the turbo once mine are on. Geeeez!!
07-12-2007, 02:04 PM
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FWIW, my issue definintely isn't related to the stud length problem. I had it backwards initially but could see it wasn't going to seal like that so I pulled the whole thing out and redid it on the bench.
I've closely checked all the manifold-head connections and the manifold-turbo flange connection for leaks. No sign of any soot anywhere and no leaking sounds. I've also checked every boot from the turbo outlet to the intake horn and they all appear very tight with no signs of slippage. I went through and tightened all the boot clamps up a few weeks ago. There are no boost leak sounds coming from anywhere. The boost numbers have been consistent with the new turbo since install and the only thing I touched was the compressor outlet boot, so it doesn't really seem like a boost or drive pressure leak. Any other things I should check for to eliminate those possibilities?
I've closely checked all the manifold-head connections and the manifold-turbo flange connection for leaks. No sign of any soot anywhere and no leaking sounds. I've also checked every boot from the turbo outlet to the intake horn and they all appear very tight with no signs of slippage. I went through and tightened all the boot clamps up a few weeks ago. There are no boost leak sounds coming from anywhere. The boost numbers have been consistent with the new turbo since install and the only thing I touched was the compressor outlet boot, so it doesn't really seem like a boost or drive pressure leak. Any other things I should check for to eliminate those possibilities?
07-12-2007, 02:30 PM
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Well...I just got my 62/71/13 ss handed to me by the UPS guy, along with my new Predator. I'm hoping to use the predator to get rid of TM down low and then use the Hot Juice/EZ to fuel mid and top. Diablo is building some pretty sweet custom tunes with no timing, less timing, etc. They are extremely proactive with their customer requests. I think if you could get a tune where the TM was minimized so your low end would fuel harder I bet you could spool that 64 to no end. Also, about the manifold, I have the ATS and I'm glad. Once I felt how much heavier the 13 ss is over my HTB2 I would not want to hang that off of the stocker for any amount of money. Just my .02
07-12-2007, 02:41 PM
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Well...I just got my 62/71/13 ss handed to me by the UPS guy, along with my new Predator. I'm hoping to use the predator to get rid of TM down low and then use the Hot Juice/EZ to fuel mid and top. Diablo is building some pretty sweet custom tunes with no timing, less timing, etc. They are extremely proactive with their customer requests. I think if you could get a tune where the TM was minimized so your low end would fuel harder I bet you could spool that 64 to no end. Also, about the manifold, I have the ATS and I'm glad. Once I felt how much heavier the 13 ss is over my HTB2 I would not want to hang that off of the stocker for any amount of money. Just my .02
Does it reduce the TM even more than the Smarty Wild though?
07-12-2007, 02:49 PM
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I was on the forum over on Diablos web site for a while before I bought one. From what others are saying you can hardly touch the pedal without bouncing your head off of the head rest. They have several different TM tunes now so you can pick and choose what you like. Here is a link to the forum over there. Pretty good reading and a lot of familiar names too.
http://www.diablosport.com/index.php...viewforum&f=27
07-12-2007, 02:53 PM
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I HAVE also tried and checked and double checked everything you have
j russel and same results. I am also wondering if smarty doesn't have something to do with it but it is such an aggresive dl and i think it fuel harder down low than anything out there. If I put more fuel with this turbo with injectors and fass 150 i am sure my egt's would be threw the roof (more fuel higher egt's) so Idon't know how this would help
j russel and same results. I am also wondering if smarty doesn't have something to do with it but it is such an aggresive dl and i think it fuel harder down low than anything out there. If I put more fuel with this turbo with injectors and fass 150 i am sure my egt's would be threw the roof (more fuel higher egt's)
so Idon't know how this would help
07-12-2007, 03:02 PM
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I HAVE also tried and checked and double checked everything you have
j russel and same results. I am also wondering if smarty doesn't have something to do with it but it is such an aggresive dl and i think it fuel harder down low than anything out there. If I put more fuel with this turbo with injectors and fass 150 i am sure my egt's would be threw the roof (more fuel higher egt's) so Idon't know how this would help
j russel and same results. I am also wondering if smarty doesn't have something to do with it but it is such an aggresive dl and i think it fuel harder down low than anything out there. If I put more fuel with this turbo with injectors and fass 150 i am sure my egt's would be threw the roof (more fuel higher egt's)
so Idon't know how this would helpMore fuel doesn't mean more EGT all of the time. More fuel with inadequate air means more EGT. You need fuel to spool the turbo and build boost which in turn cools down the charge. Last time I pulled I pulled a hill with my Juice on level 1 and the EZ on level 1. My EGT climbed to 1340. I backed out of it and went to level 0 it climbed higher. I couldn't figure it out. On the way back on the same hill but other side loaded the same only a little steaper incline I went to level 3 on the Juice and kept the EZ on level 1. EGT's stayed under 1300 and I was able to use the cruise control and stayed about 68 MPH. My boost stayed around 35 PSI where as before it wouldn't even get to 25. Big difference. That was with the HTB2 so now with the 71mm turbine wheel and bigger, more efficient housing I'm hoping to shave off even more EGT and lower my drive pressure. I think I'll be there. Plus with the downloader I'm hoping to keep the turbo spooled with lower RPM. We shall see.
07-12-2007, 03:39 PM
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yee haw just saw 48 psi with hose clamped. Now is this a bad actuater or is the gate just set way low. however russel i was not watching my pyro so couldn't tell ya bout that but I finally saw real boost not 30psi I knew smarty could do it
07-12-2007, 03:44 PM
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Did it make a difference with the lag when taking off from a standstill?
07-12-2007, 04:03 PM
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lag was less smoke was less more power, everthing is better but what know is the actuater bad or just way to low?????? I guess I just keep the vise grips on high tech would love that knowing that is how I have to make power