I don't know which forum to put this in... I'll pick this one and call the Ford truck the "accessory" to the engine... LOL.

I'd like to swap a Gen 3 into my '99 Ford Superduty. (CC, SWB, 2WD, ZF6, 3.73) I've got all the pieces of the puzzle figured out, including most of the electronics.

I'm having a bit of trouble figuring out which Gen 3 to put in.

I'm not terribly familiar with the Gen3s. I heard there were some injector problems with the early ones. I'd like to avoid those engines. I want an engine that runs smooth and quiet.

I definitely want the 325/600 output. I'll probably keep it mostly stock once I get it in. I'll be installing it with a 51" Donaldson + 4" exhaust and a BHAF and exhaust brake.

I was talking to an ex Dodge/Cummins tech turned salesman and he stated that the 05 engines are extremely hard to work on because they won't run if any component on the truck is changed, like the instrument cluster or ignition key. Is this true ? He claimed it was a theft deterent thing ? Can it be disabled in the ECM ?

Which engine had the electric fan clutch ? Is that worth striving for ?

I've asked Dodge about warranty on the engine and they said definitely not. I asked Cummins and they said the same thing.

I'm a bit worried about injector problems as I'll be diagnosing and replacing on my own at my own expense.

Which engine would you buy ? Any and all advice would be greatly appreciated.

Who makes the ECM for the DC ISBes ? Dodge or Cummins ? Is there any relationship to the Cummins ECMs ? Does anyone know where I can get the connectors that plug into the ECMs ?

Thanks !

 

Are you sure you don't want to just buy a Dodge?

Sorry, I can't answer most of your questions......but you might check with "59FORD" on this site. He put a Cummins motor in a 1990 Ford so he may have some advise for you. Good luck with your project!

 

ok , the dodge uses a CM848 ecm which doubles as a ecm and pcm, and the ISB in the truck use a CM850 , if you use the CM848 you will have to get it done at Dodge for any changes in parameter or calibration, if you use the CM850, you can go to any Cummins dealer or distributor that uses Insite and make any changes you want , the CM850 engine would be a great swap into your Ford , but it will be a EGR and VGT engine and capable of 300h.p. and 660 torque . you wont be disappointed with the powerband with that engine , and the EGR system have been doing great compared to the bigger engine. now even easier swap would be a ISB truck engine. the 275 h.p. engine would be great in the Ford. there are quite a few of them around. you could send pm to DDestruel.... he has done one and know quite a bit about doing the repower.

 

"Are you sure you don't want to just buy a Dodge? "

I gave it a lot of thought... first of all, my Superduty is a CC and it is pretty hard for me to move the Dodge cab because it is smaller and we are used to the CC space. I talked to a dealer about the mega cab and they are going to be scarce for a while. Furthermore, I am not happy that the wheel base is so long on those mega cabs, for only a 6.5' box.

Then there is the matter of all the work I've done to my truck. The trailer hitch, tires, exhaust, wiring, stereo, etc. I think it will take as much work to redo that on a new truck as it will to put in the Cummins.

Then there is the cost. My truck is paid for. My PSD engine is probably sold. I just don't want to invest more money into a new truck when mine is like new and all set up, except that I want a better engine.

I don't mean to rain on Dodge products. They are are nice. They just don't work for me right now. The only reason I just wrote this is to justify my reasoning.

"ok , the dodge uses a CM848 ecm which doubles as a ecm and pcm, and the ISB in the truck use a CM850"

I think I am pretty much forced into using the Dodge Cummins because of availability. There are actually quite a few around.

The reason I asked the ECM question was that I was wondering how hard it would be to transplant a Cummins ECM onto a DC engine if the 05s have the theft deterent stuff on them and I can't find an 04.5. I forgot about the VGT and EGR. I was thinking it was like the T444E, which can be moved from Ford to International and back.

"if you use the CM848 you will have to get it done at Dodge for any changes in parameter or calibration, if you use the CM850, you can go to any Cummins dealer or distributor that uses Insite and make any changes you want"

That would have been nice...

"now even easier swap would be a ISB truck engine. the 275 h.p. engine would be great in the Ford. there are quite a few of them around. you could send pm to DDestruel.... he has done one and know quite a bit about doing the repower."

That isn't a common rail engine and that is one of my criteria. Furthermore, aren't they rev limited to 2600 RPM ? What year of truck did he put it in ?

Thanks for the replies.

 

ok. why dont you put a powerstroke in you ford?

 

Do you have a gasser in the Ford, or PSD? Could give a call to http://fordcummins.com/ That is what they do.

If you are used to driving a CC truck, the Mega-cab would be shorter than your truck. Unless maybe if you have a shortbox. If you have a CC and long box, your truck is longer than my dually.

 

"ok. why dont you put a powerstroke in you ford?"

Its got one. Its a mediocre engine. I want a common rail Cummins.

"If you are used to driving a CC truck, the Mega-cab would be shorter than your truck. Unless maybe if you have a shortbox."

I have a short box. That was the SWB part of it...

"If you have a CC and long box, your truck is longer than my dually."

It is a a short box. And your point is ?

Can we get back to the question at hand ? Which 3rd gen engine should I use and where can I get ECM connectors ?

Thanks.

 

I would find a 12v, personally. Less electronics. For the money saved you could get at least the same amount of tq, not sure on hp. I also like the sound of the 12v more, but I could be alone on that one (but I kinda doubt it).

 

After my engine changes, I learned one thing. I would never install a Dodge engine in a Dodge truck. Use a full bread Cummins, including the electronics. More power, better economy, cooler temperatures, and so on. The torque difference is dramatic. Mine is 660 versus 460, that is more than a little difference.

 

personally, I would find one out of a wreck motorhome or truck, then you have a engine that can be check out at any Cummins place and you will have parts at them also. the repower would not be that bad.... actually pretty easy , dont know what trans you want to use. at work we have done over a hundred repowers of these engine for the mechanical 8.3 engine. they have more power with the ISB then the old 8.3 C engine. now of those hundred we have done, we have probably replaced 80% of the lift pump (transfer pump) they just weren't made to suck fuel from a source 20 feet away. once warranty run out they will be placing the pump at the tank. til then Cummins pays for the tow and repair. any ECM connector you need can be gotten at any Cummins as long as the parts man know what he is looking for. From what I have been reading on here , seems Dodge dealer dont really carry any parts for the Cummins and the common rail being still all warranty, Star only releases parts when needed to be done.

Oh yeah, that engine you put in your Ford would still qualify for warranty work at any Cummins dealer or distributorship. no question ask about what it is in. as long as it wasn't a Dodge version.

 

I woould get an 05 or 04.5 put a fass on it with the smallest micron filter available. That will hopefully take care of the injectors

 

"any ECM connector you need can be gotten at any Cummins as long as the parts man know what he is looking for."

Lol. I've yet to find someone that knows much about the newer engines. Everyone is pretty comfortable with the mechanical engines, but as soon as you ask questions about the electronics, especially on a Dodge engine, they stop talking. Of course nobody at Dodge knows anything about putting an engine in a Ford !

I think I've got things figured out now. It has taken a while.

I'm pretty sure I am going to chose an 04.5 or a 05. Can anyone make recommendations about those ?

 

I would advise you to at least consider a 12V,but if your hard headed,like me... take a look at these guys www.fordcummins.com oh,and take a look at my sig... Adios.

 

Everyone keeps telling me to put in a 12V and yet I think the Gen3 (common rail) engine is quieter, cleaner, more powerful, etc. If my truck ever has to go through inspection I can point out that the engine is newer and cleaner than the one it came with. I couldn't say that about a 12V.

Is there something I should know about the Gen3 engines that makes them less desireable than the 12V ?

Everyone says it is easier to swap in a 12V because it is all mechanical. I think the Gen3 is easier because the engine electronics seem to work well with what is already in my Superduty. For example, the accelerator is electronic, cruise control is electronic, etc. If everything works the way I think it will, I should have fully functioning gauges, air bags, ABS, cruise control, etc. The Cummins ECM seems to be much easier to wire into a vehicle than a PSD or a gasser would be. It is almost like wiring in a commercial truck engine, like a 3126 or something. Except that nobody has written a manual on how to do it... I've spent a lot of time looking at wiring diagrams...

 

I would get the 305 engine and add a mild box to it.

The 325 engine only lets you have more power when the fan and acessories are on. There will never be more than 560ft lbs to the torque converter and the 305 engine will get better fuel economy due to the advanced injection timing.