Cleaver

??? Myself and three friends of mine at work have all just purchased 2003-2004 HO diesels and are looking at installing cold air intakes. We live in Boise and one of us is buds with a bully dog distributor. He told my friend that they were getting large gains (30+ hp) out of their system. (It must be tricking the MAp sensor is my best guess.) Have any of you installed it yet and seen good improvements? It seems lots of folks in the forums like the scotty III system but I have yet to see dyno charts for it. None of us want to sacrifice filtration for power (she has plenty already but more is always better, isn't it?) My dream truck has to last a LONG time. I am getting @ 18-19 on the highway right now ( truck still isn't broken in ), what kind of MPG gains will I see? Any control boxes worth a try? Thanks for any input.

4x4

welcome!
Not too shure I can answer your question, but I do know the more time you spend here the more power your truck is going to have and the less money you'll have.
Someone better will be along shortly to answer you question.

4x4

Agades

30 hp + gain from a cold air intake

me thinks someone is blowing a little smoke
or maybe smoking a little blow

the biggest improvement of a cold air intake is EGT drop. It may give you a few hp but 30 hp is a bit on the high side

How much does it reduce your max exhaust temp at a given hp level ?
How much more cfm of air does it flow than the stock air box?
and
What temp is the air that is being SUCKED?

these are the things you want to know about a cold air intake

The great thing about the scotty products is they use a HUGE filter and SUCK air from outside the engine compartment

I am not affiliated with scotty however
I am a bit biased to the scotty product simply because I KNOW it works and works well
and its a lot cheaper than buying a hood with a functional scoop

PADZZ

I had a Scotty III installed and noticed no diff. on either power or MPG. BUT, after I installed the 4" exhaust, my MPG went up almost 2 MPG. No guages installed.......

LinearX

[quote author=Cleaver link=board=49;threadid=22583;start=0#msg211146 date=1069202401]
??? Myself and three friends of mine at work have all just purchased 2003-2004 HO diesels and are looking at installing cold air intakes. We live in Boise and one of us is buds with a bully dog distributor. He told my friend that they were getting large gains (30+ hp) out of their system. (It must be tricking the MAp sensor is my best guess.) Have any of you installed it yet and seen good improvements? It seems lots of folks in the forums like the scotty III system but I have yet to see dyno charts for it. None of us want to sacrifice filtration for power (she has plenty already but more is always better, isn't it?) My dream truck has to last a LONG time. I am getting @ 18-19 on the highway right now ( truck still isn't broken in ), what kind of MPG gains will I see? Any control boxes worth a try? Thanks for any input.
[/quote]

That is the Bully Dog claim, but someone on TDR did a back to back comparison of the stock box and the Bully Dog box on a dyno. I can't remember the specifics (i.e. if there was a big fan aimed at the front of the truck), but I don't think that there was 1hp difference between the 2 setups.

The thing that you're going to get from a better flowing cold air intake setup is faster turbo spool and lower EGTs. Any claims for big horsepower gain are bunk in my opinion.

Notice that I have a Scotty3 on my truck and I don't believe any claims of horsepower gain on it (not that they make that claim in the first place). I do, however, believe that when I put a box on it that I'm going to have more manageable EGTs than I would with the factory setup.

Push Rod

The 2003/04 Dodges use an IAT/Air Pressure sensor in the airbox to alter their fueling and timing maps to keep emissions under control at all temperatures and elevations. This sensor is continuously providing the ECM with feedback as to what the outside conditions are.

Out of curiosity, some testing was done with IAT/AP sensor to see how much of an effect it really did have on fueling levels. The IAT/AP sensor was removed from the filter box and placed inside a sealed box. The pressure inside the sealed box set to sea level and a dyno run done. Then pressure was dropped in the box to simulate an additional 1000ft of altitude and another dyno run done. This was done in the 1000 ft increments up to a simulated 11,000 ft of altitude. What was found was the truck gradually lost power on the dyno, up to 70 HP at the 11,000 foot mark.

So the IAT/AP sensor does indeed have a fairly profound effect on fueling levels. Does this mean you're missing 70 HP at 11K? Probably not, as there are other factors to consider as the elevation climbs which may reduce the effects of the lost fueling, however you will definitely be seeing some ECM-induced loss of power as you climb up the mountain.

Now to get to the point: When driving the Dodge truck with the factory airbox in place, there is definitely a starvation situation going on which lowers the overall pressure inside the airbox. Even if your altitude hasn't changed, the pressure inside the airbox has, and the ECM drops fueling to compensate. The HP gains that Bully and other manufacturers have seen are simply due to eliminating this restriction, and allowing the ECM to fuel at the level that it should be fueling at.

So HP gains? I suppose it could be considered that, but I tend to feel its simply giving you back what you should have already had. As for predicting how much gain you'll get, that would be pretty much impossible I feel, unless you were able to dyno the truck at every elevation.

On the Ram Air III, we don't promise any HP gains, and indeed we haven't even bothered to dyno the unit yet. Its awful tough to test a Ram Air product on a dyno, as there is absolutely no air movement to allow the unit to function as it should. Will it flow more than a stock airbox while its on the dyno? Definitely. Will it flow more than an open air element on the dyno? Dunno, probably not. Will it flow more than an open element system on the road? Definitely. We use a larger filter than any of the other units, and we have a direct shot of guided airflow coming right into the forward nozzle. Our EGT reductions are in the 150F area with only an Edge EZ installed in the 60 HP setting.

Most of our customers have noticed an increase in throttle response from about 1800 RPM and up, and some timing tests that have been done seem to indicate a gain of around 20 - 30 HP at this point. However, as a fueling box was added, these gains were minimized, as the stock fueling curves were messed with a bit by the box.

Cleaver

Thanks so much for all your input. I found those rumors hard to believe about the high hp gains, who knows. I am extreemly pleased with the performance of my truck but you always need to tweek on things. I think my decision will come down to price. The scotty 3 system is the front runner so far. Any more input is appreciated.
Mike

BADBOWTIE

I have a Scotty 3 installed in my truck. I have seen a reduction in EGTs of about 120 deg and an increase in upper rpm throttle response. I am very happy with my purchase. Plus Rod is a great guy to work with. Good luck in your decision.
Jason