Zeppe807

I Hate My Dodge Steering! Soon it will be "I Hate My DODGE!"

I have had the truck for over 5 years and I still cannot get use to the fuxed up steering, lack of control, wondering... I can't get over this. I am real close to manufacturing my own steering links and machining out my spindles so that I can use heim joints or Ford tie rods joints. (I've done it for my old '90 Chevy, so don't tell me it can't be done)

I have done the '08.5+ steering link upgrade, the '12+ big steering box, Carlie Ball joints, Don Thuren Track Bar, Bilstein Steering stabilizer, wheel bearings, steering box support (now since I have the bigger box, I have to adapt it to the new one, but it still reduces the frame flex).

I have done all this in the past 7 months, and only have about 6,000 miles on the upgrade.

The thing I am having the biggest issue with is that I am have a huge wondering issue. The tie rods on the drag link are sloppy, and moving about 3/32" each, with only 6k miles on it. So I replaced them, and the new parts have the same amount of movement. Then my standard box has a sloppy gear, so I spen $800 for the upgraded box and it has a similar amount of slop! WFT?

* IS there a better source of parts than the stock dodge parts for the tie rods?

* I have not found a procedure for tightening the new steering box, does anyone have it, or suggestions?



I have so much money into this truck and this is the last straw that I have not been able to overcome: Please Help!


Thank You,
Joe

Jona Gold

Is the slop in the steering box or the intermediate shaft/rag-joint?

I also have an 06- just did the same upgrades (Carli track bar though, and no steering brace), also have 6,000+ miles on the upgrades and my steering is way better than it was, but I need to replace my intermediate shaft. I wondered why I still had a 1/4" of play in my wheel and reached up and sure enough- I can move the shaft by hand a fair amount.

The other thing that could be an issue is your tires- the 315/70/17 BFG ATs. I ran 285/70/17 BFG ATs for about 2 weeks before yanking them back off. I loved those tires on every other truck I've owned, but hated them on this one. Steering feel was terrible- especially in corners. I went back to Michelin at the time but am now running the Firestone Transforce ATs (factory 2014 take-offs). Very comparable to the BFG's traction wise in snow and such- but way better road/handling feel. The BFG AT seems linked to the Death Wobble issue too.

So my suggestions - check your rag joint on the intermediate shaft for play, and maybe consider a tire with a stronger sidewall, or a narrower width (the wider tires are notorious for tearing up the Dodge front-end prematurely).

Zeppe807

The slop is the drag link, both ends: pitman arm side, and the side that attaches to main bar between each spindle.

I would post a video, but not sure how I would link it.

I tried the Toyo Open Country At extremes and they were way worse! So I went back to the BFGs.

Zeppe807

Is this the answer? I think I may have found something!

Synergy Manufacturing Dodge Ram 2500/3500 Heavy Duty Steering Kit

Steve-l

Perhaps you are being too critical. These are trucks, not a sports car. There is a great deal of weight on the front axle for the tires sold for this truck. The sidewalls are way too tall and no way stiff enough to prevent the side loads in turns from rolling the sidewalls under the rim. Tall, wider tires may look cool, but aggravate the problem. In short, you're chasing your tail. The fault you are chasing is the tires, not the truck.

I have a set of Alcoas with 22.5" big rig tires. The sidewalls on these tires are designed for 7500 lbs. loads. With these mounted, the steering is much more precise. However, they are much heavier and less absorbing of road vibrations. The tires wear forever and the traction available is about doubled. They aren't for everybody, but they do prove my point. Unfortunately, there appears to be nothing in between available.

StealthDiesel

It's becoming evident that the 2008+ Chrysler T-style steering "upgrade" is not much better than the old style Y-steering setup for the 4wd trucks.

EMF in Canada just released their own T-style upgrade kit for US$1500...

New EMF steering - Dodge Cummins Diesel Forum



As Steve mentioned, the steering system on a solid front axle truck is always going to be lame.
My 2wd Cummins with excellent independent double A-arms and rack and pinion steering handles and steers like crap
compared to my 5.0L Mustang and my wife's Acura but my truck is light years better than a Dodge 4wd SFA truck.

Even all modern 4wd 1/2 tons have rack and pinion steering.

Also as mentioned, your load range D 315/70R17 tires with tall and soft sidewalls handle like crap.
If you want tall tires and good handling, you should really consider moving up in wheel diameter to reduce tire sidewall height for better handling.

Zeppe807

That's an awesome kit too.

And I can agree that the tires can ADD to the issue, but the issue begins with the slop in the joints. If I were to change the tires, I would still have the slop in the steering components, and the dead spot in the wheel.

I'm a mechanical dude and I can see the slop in the parts and the flex within the frame; and it should not be there. I see the parts as a issue that should not be an issue if manufacturing had any quality standards. I crawl under a ford, or a chevy, or a peterbuilt, or a kenworth and new parts don't come from the factory with this much slop. It's unacceptable.

When we say "its a heavy front end" we compensate and make excuses for a poor design and poor parts. If it was engineered correctly there would be no issues. Bigger parts, more wear surface areas, better materials, higher precision manufacturing facilities.... WE MUST DEMAND MORE FROM OUR PRODUCTS, RATHER THAN MAKE EXCUSES. IF WE DO NOT REQUIRE QUALITY PARTS, THE PARTS WILL CONTINUE TO REDUCE IN QUALITY.

Rant off.

I need a

Joe Zeppe

Danderson

Joe,
I see you have 6K on the Carli BJ's as they are 'sticky for' 2K or so.
My truck exhibits some darting with my 150 mile old Dynatrac BJ's.
I've driven my friend's identically equipped '05 with the BFG 315's and they are a factor. His definitely wanders more. The 50 psi max doesn't say much for sidewall stability regardless of stated load capacity.
I've got the Toyo 285-75-17 AT2's and aren't aware of any tire squirm. I run them at 65 psi with my constant 2K load.
The EMF steering out of Canada shows promise and the guys on the DTX site are anxious to convert over. We'll see what the consensus of opinion is after installation.
We've got an '05 Pilot and indeed it's a pleasure to drive coming out of my beast.
I've got my eyes on Cooper's ST Maxx 305-70-18's next time around on some Method 18 x 9 wheels with 5.75" of backspace. 3 ply sidewalls.

Steve-l

Joe,
I agree that slop anywhere in the steering system is a problem, but I am confused. Please tell me just where you have found the play. Is it the tapered joints themselves? I have a box stock '04 that has no slop in any joint. I did have to replace a tie rod on the passenger side last year, because it just wore out. The Moog replacement was tight with no play as well. On the '04, it is not possible to replace just the rod ends. The entire rod is preassembled and very easy to change. I find it very hard to fault the factory design. In 2010 I drove my dually through Switzerland right across the top of the Alps down into Italy and back across very winding roads, extremely steep hills and very sharp off camber curves. I went light and returned heavy. It was very challenging with the narrow roads, 8' width and long length, but I could keep up with anyone and still have the power, brakes and handling to pass whenever needed. I think that is pretty **** impressive for a truck that weighs 3.5 tonnes (7,700 lbs.) empty. Yet, I'm still on all the original front end parts, with the exception of one tie rod, after 10 years. That too is very impressive. Perhaps usage is a factor.

DodgeChallenger

Lower the truck and go back to stock tires! I have contemplated the larger tires but the issues with them are not worth it. I have 80,000 miles on mine since new and done nothing to the steering and it steers like new still. How much off road do you do that justifies the big wheels.

DarkPaladin

BD-Power Performance Dodge Steering Stabilizer

I have that on my truck. All my friend that drive dodges, fords, and chevys, think my truck drives like a ferrari compared to theirs. This is the only thing done to my steering. Other than the 08+ update they did years ago. They all are amazed at how nice it handles. Stock shocks and everything. 64k on the ticker and an 05....

Zeppe807

I have one for the old box size, it may not support the new output shaft, but it still reduces the frame flex by at least an 1/8"

That was a huge change when I first installed it years ago.

Joe

Zeppe807

Well, We have about 1000 acres in the hills, I off-road race, hunt, fish, and explore. I don't beat my truck, but I need the added traction and clearance. It may not be a bunch of lift, but it is enough... It ain't no mall crawler.



I hear ya though,
Joe

banyon

My truck did the same thing. Mine is nor leveled but I have 285 tires on it. I was sick of the wandering but just figured it was a Dodge thing. Well when I took it to get some new tires the tire shop told me I needed ball joints. It had a little slack but not as much as I would think would make it drive bad. Well long story short I had new joints put in and at 255,000 miles it drives great. My point is that there is something wrong for your truck to drive really bad. I hope you find it, good luck.

Danderson

My '07 tracks way better than my '98.5.
If you want to drive a real wandermatic,get behind the wheel of a Ford Dana 44 Twin Traction Beam.