The cam is not the only thing that creates the in-clinder EGR, you achieve the same results by changing the turbo to something that does create so high of drive pressures at the higher exhaust flows. As posted, if you go back to a 24V cam you get rid of some of the designed in cam profile specs that contribute.

The PDR cam seems to be one of he bst choices for a cam swap that actually performs well for a towing application.

Tming hain? Not in a Cummins. They are gear drive. What do you mean by service on the 5.9? The 5.9 CR is designed for a 750k service life under normal conditions. Normal check period for compression and leak down is still in the 350k range.

Given good periodic service and used within its design parameters the only reason to dig into service life issues would be symptoms. That said, doubtful the injectors are going to go that long and that will contribute greatly to wear and service life. The reality is the injectors hsould be pulled very 100-150k and checked if you want the engine as whole to last to designed service life.

 

Thats very odd as many 6.7 owners are reporting clean oil with a EGR delete. And why would the 6.7 have an in-cylinder and a external EGR. And the 03-04 is supposed to have a different grind than the 04.5-07.

 

Ok... you say third event is for power and emissions. I say diesels make power down low... BELOW 2000 rpms. And emissions? What percentage of time are you at 2500 rpms or above? Where does the stock 5.9 make it's highest torque. ??? around 1600 rpm's. Your statements hold no water. The third event drops off after certain rpm's. It is there for emissions, sound abatement and power in lower rpm's only.

 

Dodge has to make their enignes drive like gas engines to sell. So there is power in the upper rpm band. Yes you have peak tq at 1600, but peak hp is at 2900 and the tq curve is very flat (at least 555tq from 1400-2900).. And there is a big factory defuel below 2000 rpms; which is why the sweet spot in the HPCR has been deemed around 2200 rpms. I have seen plenty of hills that I can't pull at 1600-1800 rpms that I can at 2200 rpms, why is that if the tq is higher? HP.. tq gets the load moving, hp keeps it moving.. so low peak tq is good for acceleration of a heavy load, but you need tq and hp to keep it there.

I have read the argument for high rpm and low rpms for the 3rd event. Some say its low and is really just the main event split at low coolant temps to decrease the time to warm up (as evidenced on EGT gauge).. others say its upper rpms for power and emissions (which can also be seen on the DP gauge, and EGT's).

Marco deleted the 3rd event and lost power on the dyno. Thats why its still there.. But its unknown if the event made the power or if the ECM didn't like the missing event.

There is evidense that supports both argument, which is why there will always be the argument, but I have also read where people have monitored the 3rd event on an oscilloscope and that it was at upper rpms. I guess until we get a programmer like EFI Live (wont happen because of how Dodge programs the ECM) we won't know for 100%.

The 3rd event has nothing to do with combustion sound, that's the pre-event only, and IIRC that drops off at a certain rpm as well...

 

The 5.9 makes TQ below 2000 rpms not HP. Higher HP is where EGR is needed to lower the NOX creation. With the retarded timing on the emissions engines NOX is NOT a problem at lower rpms because the timing is not advanced enough hence you do not get the cylinder pressures and temps where NOX forms. The main injection event is still the bulk of the fuel and that drives the TQ at lower r's. When r's are high injection is advanced to compensate so with a single injection event the TQ starts falling as the big bang is much earlier in the cycle. Add a trailer to the main, event or a 3rd event, and you maintain the pressures needed to keep TQ flat not falling.

This is all basic diesel combustion theory, design, programming, and testing information available in multiple places and formats. Dispute it if you want but your satements are the ones that are leaky.

First thing you need to get over is peak TQ at 1600 rpm's n a CR. It doesn't happen, its a fact, get used to it. Given a stock tune, peak TQ on the CR engines is 2500-2600 rpm's, its been proven time and time again with dyno sheets. The TQ peak will run from about 1600 rpms to 2900 rpm's, if you can get the engine to load and fuel at 1600, which in most cases is impossible because the boost is not there and the TQ management starts defuel hard at 1800 rpms. At 1600 rpms the stock CR is at 40% of fueling, hardly gonna make its peak TQ there.

Once again, look at dyno sheet of a stock CR tune and all this is self evident if you understand the theory and operation.

Facts in evidence indicate otherwise. Dyno sheets, design specs, scope traces, and last but not least experience all refute that statement. Leaky, very leaky.

Marco tried removing the 3rd event and reported a loss of 100 hp. Why? Because it is integral to the amount of fuel injected to make the power ACROSS the rpm band AND the timing curve. Advanced timing and lack of fuel at the correct time in the upper rpm's will cause the engine to flat line on power.

Observerved drive pressures spike sharply under heavy acceleration right about 2500 rpm's and continue to defuel point. Easy the rpms up to 2900 with no load and the sharp spike and high DP are NOT EVIDENT. Why??because the 3rd event is also load sensitive to address high cylinder pressures and temps created by high load conditions which happen when? You got it, higher rpms due to timing and load.

NOT a lot of mystery left there.

 

I gues that is why i hae seen such good results going to a 65mm exhaust wheel with a 12cm exhaust housing combined with the helix II. doesnt feel like it has a cork int he exhaust now

I can see in my sideview mirror when the third event kicks in now...I guess because the cam changed where the fuel is injected with the exhaust valve open now.....resulting in the smoke i see appear about 2500 rpm running it hard.

 

I have always thought it weird that no matter how much I fuel I can't seem to get any WOT smoke... that must be from the cam.

 

The HE351 already has a 65 mm exhaust wheel and the 9cm open design is capable of flowing what the older 12cm Holeset housing did. Going to something like an S300 12cm is a big difference in flow.

Couple that to a cam profile that is more concerned with getting air in and out efficiently it does feel like the cork has been removed.

Yes, more noticeable smoke would track with the lobe profile and split change as it is not fully burning the trailing event before it is exhausted.

 

I have always read that the HE351 is a 60/60/9 turbo. Where did you get the 65 data?

 

i forgot to mention it does the smoking from the 3rd event on stock fueling, or my jr set at any SW


I always read the HE 351 was a 60/60-9 as well.

My oil stays clean now for about 1500 miles before it starts looking black

 

i think i have said it before, but it seems like us folks with a cam might could benifet from the 3rd injection event either being removed or the timing for it being adjusted??

Just a thought?

 

Can you run TM4 and not get the crazy smoke?

 

yes, but i still get the smoke when the 3rd injection event hits

 

thats not bad thou. Is it black or just a haze? About what rpm does it hit?

 

just a dark haze...hits about 2500 rpm, I am at full boost by about 1800 rpm...which is 38-40 psi