Are these trucks supposed to skid the front end so easily on wet roads when heavily braking. Its got new pads and back brakes shoes had over 60% and are adjusted properly

 

If your truck is like mine it does not have 4-wheel abs...just abs in the rear. I've had it slide on several occasions, before and after the EGR brake upgrade. The last time it did it I was pulling a boat and had to get on the brakes due to some trouble ahead and even though I was well behind the car in front of me I could not stop the truck and came about four or five feet from sliding into the car in front of me. It turns out that ther back brakes don't do much at all on these trucks and the performance was in fact worse when I put the discs on the rear. What I ended up doing was welding a turnbuckle in the connecting rod between the rear axle and the proportioning valve so I could adjust it and now it stops great.

 

What shape are your tires in? That's part of the braking system.

 

This is the reason many folks upgrade to bigger rear brake cylinders - NAPA# 4637337.
About $13 each and an easy direct bolt on replacement.
No more front end diving with the larger cylinders when the rears start doing their fair share of the work.

 

Holy cow, the brakes on these 12-valved trucks are big pieces of dog crap!

Ever since I got my 96, I've had nothing but problems with the brakes. I've had leaking wheel cylinders, leaking calipers, stuck calipers, bad master cylinder, bad rubber lines, bad low-vac switch, back wheels locking up, front wheels locking up, you name it. I've replaced nearly every component of the brake system on that truck, almost $2000 now. In 20 years of doing brakes, this is the worst brake system I've ever seen.

Since I changed the master cylinder--my last problem--I've had a leaking brake line, a leaking caliper, and a leaking wheel cylinder. I'm afraid to even bleed the system now, for fear I'll have another leak afterwords. What's with this thing, is it possessed or what? In contrast, my 01 24-valver, stops in half of a dime, just lightly touch the pedal and you're stopped, and I have drums on the back.

Sorry didn't mean to hijack, back to the original question.

megajoltman:
You should definitely consider installing the bigger wheel cylinders that Infidel recommended, I did see a big improvement when I installed mine. Oh, NAPA said that the 4637337 part number was being phased out, the new number is just 37337, so try both. Don't tell them what truck they are for, just give the the part number. Oh, and when you're done make sure to adjust the brakes really good, so they drag a bit on the drums. I think its easier to just take the drums off to do this, but that's just me.

Infidel:
I tried your back-up-and-stop-with-the-parking-brake trick, it didn't work on mine (of coarse), and I have new adjusters. Did I do something wrong?

 

I fully agree with the new rear cylinders, i put them on mine and it made a huge difference.I adjust mine with the drums on and turn them up until they just start to drag a bit as you turn the wheel.Everytime i back up and i am alone i always hit the brakes fairly hard and come to a complete stop, i find my rears stay adjusted really well by doing this.
I just cleaned up a front pull problem with new flex lines, they get old and balloon a bit which releases some pressure to the calipers. My braking has improved tons now

 

I have toyo hyparadial ST tires that seem to have fair tread, kind of look like the open country ones but I can't find this model anywhere.

I new I should have put the chevy rear brake cylinders on when I had it all apart

This thing sure makes me nervous driving in the rain which we get tons of during the winter.

 

Most important things are to do it on a paved road and to come to a complete stop. Speed doesn't matter.
I have no doubt this won't work on all trucks. I've fooled around with these POS Dodge self adjusters for years and for the life of me can't figure out why sometimes they work and other times not.

 

Be careful putting those chevy wheel cylinders on folks , i thought that would be a good idea this past weekend, i needed to replace mine anyways , as my bleeders were stuck , and i thought there to be air in the system , because i had very little brake pedal , long story short , the ONLY things in the brake system i have not replaced since the weekend is the front rotors , and the front pads , and i STILL have no brake pedal when the truck is running....

 

JKM, are you front calipers on upside down?
Bleeder should be at the top.

 

I agree with the poor performance of these breaks. I did the rear cylinder mod and it helps alot but its tough to keep my shoes back there adjusted. My prop valve is tied in the upword position. I think i might just bypass it completely when I put my stainless braided lines on. Also dont forget to check your hard lines from your master cylinder down to the frame. Mine are rusted VERY badly and need replacement. I allready know of people who hit the breaks and had those lines rupture because of bad rust. My calipers also pull hopefully like was said the flex lines are bad and the new braided lines will fix that as well as take out some of the sponge in the pedle.

 

Funny you mention that , someone else suggested it too, but they are indeed on right side up , i have bled all air from the system, even threw new pads on it this morning , no difference.

If i pinch the front flex lines with vice grips , i have awsome pedal , it is hard as a rock , unclip one and it drops abit , unclip both lines , and the pedal will go right to the floor if i press on it with the truck running.

 

Does your truck still stop?
Mine does the same thing, but I can still stop. If I keep pumping it will build up, but eventually it will go right to the floor. I've replaced the master cylinder, both calipers, both wheel cylinders, and all rubber brake lines, and it still does it. Say I'm driving along, about 40-50mph, if I step on the pedal the truck will stop at about half a pedal or so, now once I'm stopped if I keep pushing it the pedal will go all the way to the floor, then if I pump it, it will get hard then eventually go down again. Its always done this. Since I've already replaced everything that could leak, I'm thinking this is normal, just the vacuum booster running out of vacuum and then building itself up again. The only other thing is a bad combination valve, which I guess could be the problem if it has an internal leak, but the warning light is off. I don't know, I'm all out of options.

The only thing I would add is to be careful pinching those rubber lines, I've heard you can collapse them internally by pinching them like that (yes I know, professional mechanics do it all the time).

 

I was abit apprehensive about pinching the lines, but they are brand new , so if something went wrong , i would get warrantied ones from napa.

My pedal does the same thing , if i pump it , it will come up , but that is only because i run out of vaccum at idle , as soon as it builds the pedal drops again.

The truck does stop , but it is the rear brakes doing ALL of the work right now, i tried jumping on the pedal really quick , and it only locked the rears, it should lock all 4 with enough pedal pressure IMO , it will hardly lock the fronts on gravel , so something IS wrong.

Both my Fathers 97 , and my friends 98 12v have awsome brakes , granted they both have hydroboost (which IIRC has more boost force , so it SHOULD drop the pedal even more) The pedal moves no more than 2" in either of those trucks , and it is firm.

I wonder if it is possible that the newer trucks have different master cylinders that make up for this problem we seem to have...

Anyone out there with a 94-96 CTD that has good brakes and a stiff pedal?

 

my 98 so far has decent brakes, I looked in tech manual about bleeding procedures, on the combination vale there is a pin that needs to be pushed in or pulled out when bleeding,also to start in left rear, then right rear, right front, and finally the left front. as for peddle hight, i agree about adjusting rear brakes, however, the reverse&stop method may not work if the shoes are to far out of adjustment. then you need to do it the 'fun' way-manually