doodah

well, i thought i did, but now you got me curious! i will have to look!

Rattletrap1

Bearing of some sort no doubt.

calls

I crawled all over that dang truck and can't find any loose connections, battery cables LOOK good and are clean, connections at starter SEEM ok. I am going to have the batteries tested tomorrow since I'm off just in case. I got in it this morning, turned the key on, let it cycle once and it started rite up like there was never a problem. It was 32 or so at the house this morning so it would have normally done it but not today. I am starting to think maybe one of my buddies is in the bushes laughing his butt off at me while he plays with my head I ordered the Larry B kit JUST IN CASE. I figure 40 bucks is A LOT cheaper than a couple hundred and besides it can't hurt rite. IF I EVER figure this out I'll be sure and let you guys know in case someone else runs into something like this.

kd460

I'm sure it's been mentioned, but I'll go over some things that probably wont hurt.:

Start by disconnecting both positive leads on the batteries so nothing gets fried. Sorry, had to mention it. Clean all battery connections. Physically remove them and clean them. Even if they look good. Grease them up or better yet use ox-gaurd (get at home depot electrical dept-it prevents oxidization of electrical connections). Do the same thing for the negative battery cables that bolt to the block, the frame (if any), and the smaller wires that go to the body using sheet metal screws. (bolt at the block, screws at the body).

Consider adding a ground (a good thick one) from the block to the frame (if you don't have one), then to the body. Call me crazy, but I did have a ground wire on my GM truck that went from the block to the heater core. It was there from the factory to prevent oxidization of certian parts in the cooling system, mainly the heater core and a cast magnesium fitting that was famous for corroding and leaking. Those who had it, had no problems with that fitting, those who do not (earlier models), had troubles with it corrosion/leaking.

Clean the connection point at the starter. I read a recent post that someone had corrosion that crept up the wire under the insulation. It started at the starter bolt and went up 3 inches.

Check the wires for the heater grid and relays. Start at the connections at the drivers fender. Remove the rubber covers, take each wire off one at a time and clean them with a wire brush, sandpaper, etc. Ox gaurd and re-assemble. Now follow the wire to the heater grids themselves and repeat. Same for the grounds on top of the engine near the heater grid.

Check each of the small wires at the positive terminal of the drivers side battery. They are fuse links, and a power tap. Clean the eyelets, and ox gaurd them too. Follow them and make sure they are clean, safe and secure. Don't forget the bolt that they tap to on the battery clamp. Not a bad idea to clean the terminals at the relays on the firewall. Remove the relays, clean up the blades, ox-gaurd and replace. Don't forget the terminals that the relays plug into. As a matter of fact, any wire terminal that you clean, needs to have the recieving part (the part it plugs into, bolts on to, etc.) cleaned as well. You may need to be creative with this, trying to find something to fit into the sockets, blades etc. But it is worth it. Once again, ox-gaurd. Don't forget the 2 main leads that go into the fuse box next to the battery (power distibution center).

If you need to replace any battery cables, you can get nice heavy duty wire at any welding shop. They use it on electric welders. It may be a little difficult to find the larger clamp on terminals, but they are out there at some of your better auto part stores. Don't forget to get the copper end terminals that bolt to the block (on the other end of the battery wire). I did use a GM battery terminal for this once, until I could find the correct sized copper one.

A good source for battery terminals and such is here:

http://www.wranglernw.com/commerce/default.asp

Don't forget the wires that go to the alternator, and make sure the body of the alternator is grounded well by cleaning the mounting bolts on the alternator and brackets.

Foster truck has good how to on the contacts, but heres another link that may be helpful:

http://www.fixinrams.com/id11.html

Hope this helps somebody, Kevin

kd460

Heres a quick little tidbit. Last night I got bored and decided to do a little wrenching. Removed my starter to put in new contacts and plunger.

First thing I found was that all the phillips head bolts that hold the housing on for the gears were loose. One actually fell off as I removed the starter.

The next thing I found was all kinds of gunk and junk all over the armature and the field. Real nasty thick goo. Worse than in the pick on the fixinrams link above. Easy enough to clean with some wd-40 and contact cleaner.

The other thing I found was one of the wires leading from the brushes was not soldered on any more. Don't know if it came off when I removed the brush holder, but it did not look like a drop of solder was ever on the connection point. Tricky to resolder, need a good hot soldering iron. Those little 35 watters ain't gonna cut it.

The contacts and plunger looked pretty good, but I replaced them anyways. Used the heavy duty contacts.

Everything was cleaned, lubed, loctited, and replaced. Starter really cranks better than ever (might be due to the brush wire fix, might be due to the gunk on the field and armature who knows, might be due to truck sitting in a heated garage all night.). Gears looked good as well.

The reason I did this is: Paranoid about starter contacts cooking my fuel selenoid, starter has been a little slow when cold (no problem when plugged in-I have new dual optimas-so batteries not the issue), and once every say 2-3 months I would get a grind when starter engaged (now I know why-the loose bolts on the gear housing of starter motor).

All connections cleaned, silicone grease/ox-gaurd, and good to go I hope. So far so good.

Hope this helps somebody out, Happy Holidays, Kevin

Timberman

I've got the exact same problem Calls has. I've got a 99 2500 CTD QC 4x4, and when it has sat in the cold without being plugged in, it seems the glow plugs really drain the batteries. Slows the starter pretty bad, and the volt gauge will be way to the left. Takes it about 10 seconds to start charging again. If it is above 50 degrees, or has been plugged in, it starts right up with no problem. A buddy of mine said it may be the brushes in the alternator are worn down. I replaced both batteries last year when it was doing this same stuff, and that didn't change anything. Also, the lights dim and brighten every few seconds til she warms up. I might replace the starter contacts and clean all the battery connections, just to see what happens.

Fueling around

How were the battery connections when you changed to Optimas? When people say they changed to Optimas it usually tells me they had a lot of corrosion issues. The positive terminal jumper cable between the batteries is really susceptable to corrosion at the lug on the driver's side.
Also look at the battery clamps themselves. The stock ones damage very easy.

Check the ground connections on both sides.

Make sure the grid heater relays release when the WTS light goes out. Occasionally you read of them sticking.

If you need starter contacts, your local rebuilder should have them for around $2 each. I'll do brushes the next time I pull the starter, too.

-John

kd460

Fueling Around, the battery connections on my truck look great. I learned along time ago that is one of the first things to check when experiencing slow starter and such (thanks Dad).

I went with the Optimas just because everybody here said "they are good". I like the warranty, and wanted a no brainer. Install them and not worry about them for a long time. They were just put in this fall. They replaced the original batteries (not bad considering it's a 97). So far, I am not impressed with the optimas.

All that wrenching on my starter thursday night and while I'm glad I took it apart, the cold start up test was on saturday and as far as I'm concerned, it got a "D" grade at about 5 degrees at start.

I glowed twice, cranked it and got the grind I mentioned in the earlier post. (So the grind is not caused by the loose starter gear housing) Hit the starter again and it fired but stalled. Hit starter again and it fired but stalled after sputtering a little longer. Third time I gave it a little throttle to start and it stayed running.

The vacuum pump howled for a little while, and I held the idle at about 1000-1100 to let things warm up. Otherwise no more smoke than normal.

Only difference between this year and last year (besides new batteries), is timing advanced to about 15.75. I cleaned all ground connection this past summer as part of a PM ritual I do every year. Maybe I need to go back and check things again.

Would really like to know what is causing that grinding of the starter every once and awhile. Teeth on starter and flywheel look ok. Weak throwout spring?

Thanks, Kevin

redramrider

My truck kept blowing the 20 amp fuse for the starter solenoid. I couldn't understand why it was doing this because my starter seemed to work fine when it worked, didn't drag or anything. Mechanic friend of mine called his buddy at the starter and alternator shop and he said the brushes were gone. I pulled the starter and took it to him........took it apart, threw in some new pieces, tested it and paid him $36.00. Put it back on and no more problemo's.

I put up with this fuse blowing for a couple months. I thought for sure it was gonna be some very costly item that only the dealer could fix. I guess the worn parts were drawing too much amperage or something.

It stinks not being mechanically inclined but it's sure nice to have friends who have gas and diesel certifications

neveragain

Sorry didn't read all of them. The batteries need to be warm so a battery blanket they are about $12.00 and work well below -5*C They do have a min temp to be used at.