lilkjohnson

I took my Doge Ram 2001 2500 4x4 to Cummins NW to have them see if I was getting air into the injectors through the water in fuel separator that has gone bad. They came back and told me that they ran a load test on the VP44 and at low idle it is at 16% load. They say I need to replace the pump at a cost of $3500.00. I'm no diesel mechanic, but this sound fishy to me. Can anyone comment on this? Symptoms are occasional stalling when shifting into Rev and drive. Occasional sluggish start up, and once in awhile the idle will jump from 800 rpm to 1100 rpm every 3 or 4 seconds. No codes are coming up, I have no smoke, and no loss of power or gas mileage. They did not perform a flow test which I thought was kinda weird. Isn't there some kind of control module or selenoid that would control the load being put on the pump, assuming they are telling me the real story? Someone mentioned possibly a problem with the automatic RPm controller.
I guess I should add that all my problems started the day my serpentine belt was replaced. Thanks

crobtex

I'm not sure what your problem is, but it sounds fishy to me too. I know things are higher in Alaska, but $3500 is WAY higher then anything I ever heard. I think most have paid $2000 to $2500.

If you can, wait a little while and see if someone chimes in on your thread.

RowJ

Going price in the lower 48 is $1,000 - $1,200.... anywhere but a Dodge dealers.
If your not showing codes I would doubt it's the VP-44. Or better said - I have never seen a bad one that did not show codes!

Except for increase in idle revs...sounds like bad fuel to me, or something to do with your bad water separator?? Just a guess.

I'd run it for a while till gets worse or clears up. Either way you'll get a better idea...No?

RJ

lilkjohnson

Agreed. I already decided there was no way I was going to change the pump without diffinitive proof that it is the pump. I am changing the separator valve tomorrow and if that doesn't fix it then I will try the overflow valve next.

CSAGrey1

I had mine replaced through Cummins NorthWest as well. They will not replace the IP without replacing the LP so that adds to cost (though who would? if the VP is bad you can bet the LP is bad too). I would assume they are also including the cost of the diagnostic into that price. If the IP is actually bad there is a good chance that it has left a footprint on the computer that requires reprogramming of the puter before any of their diagnostic tools can be used. (I have had this done twice) Sounds like the tested your unit the old fashioned way.

So now your looking at fees for
+reprogramming
+diagnostic
+VP
+LP
+Gasket $ Lube
+Calibration (I was charged $71 for this and now that I think about it I am not sure what they calibrated)
+Labor (if they had to check you VP the hard way instead of just plugging it in for a code this will go up)

I was quoted $3500 by the aft formentioned company as well as two local dodge dealers (they didn't even have to think about it all three just threw that number out as soon as I asked) Fortunately for me I had a couple connections and walked away paying $2,470 mopre than 1K less than what I was quoted.

J BODY

I'm at a DODGE DEALER and we have a VP/lift pump package for $1450 out the door. I feel that is very competitive.

one54ton

$3500 is outragous!!!

lilkjohnson

So I went back to Cummins and asked the tech to explain his comments and justify the costs. Here is the lowdown. He said that the IP is causing the engine to have too much load. The load should be 6% at idle. He checked the LP and it was fine putting out 15psi. Once I started asking questions he realized I knew enough about diesels to not get snowed, he started backing down and said that he wasn't sure that it was the IP that it was just his gut feel. He said that he thinks that the load has caused excessive wear in the pump and is allowing too much fuel to be returned to the tank. Again, I'm not sure if that sounds right. Any thoughts? Regardless, he finally said drive it until it dies or throws some codes. He said that the load was too high in gear as well. I would think that this would mean decreased performance in drive as well, but that is definitely not the case.

RowJ

lilkjohnson - Once again thge DTR saves a member some money!! Well done.

J BODY - My apologies for any offense! Glad you spoke up. It good to know there are some dealerships around, like yours.

RJ

signature600

Could it be the APPS??

Chris

keithw1975

Or maybe the IP needs a new bypass valve? It seems rediculous to me that you would automatically replace a lift pump just because a VP-44 died. Simply make sure the LP is putting out proper pressure, everyone should have a FP gauge, and replace it when it fails.

Keith

jriggs_18

I have a question that goes in line with this thread....If your ECM throws a code will a CEL always come on?? Particularly if it is related to the VP, or anytime a code is set for anything? I have been wondering about this for a while and wanted to make sure. Thanks

mgstroker95

$3500 Thats not a NO but a HELL NO! I dont care if you lived in western Siberia that would still be to high. I believe there are some good dealerships still around out there ( Jbody is one! ) but there are currently 0 around me or anybody that is in need. I have been a mechanic for 7yrs and I still dont see how people can sit there and tell you something is wrong with your truck when there is nothing. Un-honest people make me but hey that is why we have DTR and all the great guys who make up this site!! Also jriggs just because you have a code doesnt mean that your CEL wil come on. My VP44 and LP went south and I never had the CEL turn on. Just had the best code you can have 0216! And Johnson way to go that is what I like to hear how someone called a mechanic out and how the puss started crawfishing!!Right on bro. Thanks for all the help all you guys out there!

lilkjohnson

You're gonna love this!!! So I replaced the water in separator valve as planned. After many people including the Cummins guy telling me there was no way that the separator was the problem, it was. A $23.00 part and 5 minutes and all symptoms are gone. I drove it around all day and no more stalling or surging idle. Anyone having the same issues should spend the $$ and try that first. Thanks again to everyone. Without this forum I would have paid for a new IP. And by the way, I am a sista not a bro.

crobtex

Good job,sista! Glad it worked out for you.