ChicagoSnow

Hello,

This is my first post and after many hours of reading various topics on this forum I feel confidant in my near future (Sunday) purchase of a Cummins /Dodge pick up truck.

Not to say that my opinion matters, but I have owned many Ford 7.3's and have been pleased. Now I venture to the Cummins/Dodge combination and I would like to ask for your help.

I am purchasing a 2002 3500 cc, drw, 4x4 auto, pick up and need to know if there is anything I should look for? The truck is like new and very well cared for. If you can believe it, the truck has only 33,000 miles. It was used to pull a travel trailer and now the owner wishes move on. Will this model year have any possibility of the "53" block? I havent checked yet to see. Any other clues to check in regard to the trans, differential, engine, etc.. What will the maintenance be at the 35-40,000 mile mark (besides fluid change?)

Thanks again for your help and I will be sure to post additional questions in regard to this truck as I think of them.

Joe

PaulDaisy

Welcome to the site! Glad to see that you are not blinded by brands and willing to try another truck. I think you will like a Dodge. Having not driven a 7.3 myself I heard that they have much worse fuel mileage, like 8-10 mpg. You can expect 17-18 from your Ram.
I would look for "53" block but would not immediately disregard the truck if it has it. Many 53s are driving around without much of a problem. What I would do is check to see if the truck has a fuel pressure gauge installed, and if not, pull the DTC codes on it. If you see any codes related to the injection pump (VP44, codes like P0216), keep in mind that the IP is about $1000. With 33k miles I strongly doubt the truck will have problems with the VP though.
Post some pictures! I think you found a very good and rare truck with that kind of low mileage.
-P

ChicagoSnow

Hi Paul,

Thanks for your prompt feedback!

Your right on about the 7.3's mpg (8-10 mpg), at least with a 10,000lb. trailer anyway.

Can I "pick up" any signs while driving the truck if the injector pump is on its way out?

Appreciate your help and I will check for that dreaded #53 the next time I see the vehicle.

Joe

2500

WOW... what low mileage!

hard to go wrong with a truck w/mileage that low.

be fore-warned 24v 98.5 - 2002 has fuel injection pump/lift pump problems. costs of VP44 pump is $1100+ for parts alone.

you need to install a fuel pressure gauge. it's not unusual to hear of 24v CTD lose 2-3 lift pumps in 100k miles.

when lift pump goes out, VP44 can pull enough fuel to keep truck operating. what kills VP44 pump is loss of coolant effect when lift pump dies.

if you know exactly when lift pumps dies, it can be replaced cheaply. hopefully saving VP44.

pre 98.5 12valve CTD w/mechanical injection pumps are among the most trouble free of cummins dodge.

ChicagoSnow

2500

Is there a permanant fix for the faulty stock injector pump or do you just keep replacing them?

Based on what you said, the truck will still run even if the pump is on its way out? How can I test or what should I look for in regard to the injector pump?

Also, can you direct me to the appropriate fuel gauge that I will need?

Thanks,

Joe

wcbcruzer

Sounds like a clean truck. The injection pumps are a trouble spot. 53 block doesn't apply to 2002, so no worries, but I guess it wouldn't hurt to bend down and look anyway just to be sure. Just keep an eye on the fuel pressure. You can buy stuff to help with the fuel pressure but honostly, the vp44 just sucks imo (sorry, no offense to others on this site). There's word on a high performance vp44 coming out though, so hopefully that'll put an end to the problems. Other than that, can't go wrong...

Dinner

You can replace the stock lift pump with a FASS setup, or I believe a Holley Blue setup. The VP could still be working and operating, allowing the truck to run. But if the Lift Pump is gone on the truck, it is hard to tell if it is unless you have a fuel pressure gauge, idiot light, or the "dead pedal" starts to show. If you do not have the money, to purchase a full gauge set up. I would recommend going to your local auto parts store(where ever they would sell fuel pressure gauges) and by yourself one. I don't think they are too expensive just for one to hook on every now and then. But anywho, you could get a temporary gauge that you could hook into the fuel system somewhere (I'm not sure where for a 02, but i'm sure someone else knows the answer) and you can test the pressure right there. But if you do have the money for a good gauge, I would recommend any of the gauges off of here, or other Autometer, IsPro, DiPricol...gauges like that.

Good luck, sounds like a real nice truck with only 33xxx on it

ChicagoSnow

Thanks guys!

Well, I guess the weakness on the cummins is the injector pump (unless upgraded).

If it makes anyone feel better, here is the weakness' of the 7.3 power stroke:

1). Cam posistioning sensor: Not too expensive ($30 - used to be $150 before Ford upgraded the part and probably got sued too many times????) The problem is that the engine just dies, regardless of the speed of travel. Luckily, one time, I had a median that I could coast into with my F-350 crew cab and trailer.

2). Rusty oil pan: I just finished replacing an oil pan on a 02 F350 7.3psd. The truck also had u-joints installed, but the total repair took my shop 4+ weeks to finish the repair. $1,200+ replacement (oil pan only)

3). Rust just outside/around the rear wheel wells(single rear). Ford sandwiched together 2 sheets of steel when forming the the rear wheel wells, and wouldnt you know it, after only 5 years, it's rusting through. Repair ???

I guess the most important thing is that we know what too expect(good and bad). This forum is great and I will do my best to contribute as I progress through this new/used 3500 purchase.

I'm sure I can do a search, but does anyone have any pictures of their gauge(s) clusters? How and where will my fuel gauge, + be installed?

Thank's - Joe

PaulDaisy

My friend has talked to his contact at a Cummins dealer and according to him, the VP44 has undergone six upgrades with a part number change since it was used first in 98.5. The 2002 VP44 should be a lot better than the earlier ones. Just like everyone mentioned, if you keep an eye on the lift pump that feeds the injection pump, you will be Ok for many miles.
As far as the signs of VP problems on a test drive, you can see white smoke, or you can get the dreaded "dead pedal" syndrome. The latter seems to occur at highway speeds (55-75 mph) and feels like, you are cruising along and try to accelerate, and the truck just does not respond; or it slows down on an uphill and won't pick up when you push on the gas. But more than anything, scan for codes; the pesky injection timing code 0216 is a good indication of a problem.
But with such incredibly low mileage, I would get the truck anyway, install fuel pressure gauge and enjoy it, even is an IP is in the future. The rest of thetruck must be in excellent shape, and the VP may last for a hundred thousand miles.
You will find dozens of gauge threads. You probably will want to install the sender or the line on the bottom of the fuel filter canister using a drilled and tapped banjo bolt. If you are on a lazy side, you may prefer to connect to the schraeder valve on the injection pump, which is there to spot check the pressure directly on the pump. For me the main decision was where to put the gauge in the cab since I did not like the pillar mounts. I ended up putting the gauge down near the shifters (pics in my signature).
-P

Rattlin_Ram

It's actually the lift pump that is the main weakness. The VP44 isn't as strong as the P pumps but as long as it's given a good steady supply of fuel from the lift pump it should live a long healthy life.....

Rattlin_Ram

OH and I'm a former Ford owner as well...

ChicagoSnow

Thanks Paul and Rattlin Ram,

I appreciate your insight!

I will post some pics as soon as I get the truck(by Monday).

Thanks,

Joe

graphitecumnz

You can check the codes by doing the 'key trick'... turn the key to the on position(without starting) and then off three times in succession... it would go something like key on, key off, key on, key off, key on and leave it.... there is a rhythm to it.... the codes, if any, will flash in the odometer. This is certainly not a foolproof way to read codes, i.e. codes won't always show up here... but it works fairly well...

There are many aftermarket fixes for the poorly thought out stock lift pump configuration...

For an auto truck that has only towed, I would be a bit concerned about the trans as they don't have a great reputation but if it was properly taken care of and didn't have the coals thrown to it with a bunch of fueling mods, it should still be in fine shape.

supr

The VP is OK as long as the LP feeds it. Yes they will fail, but normally run a long, long time if they have positive fuel pressure to the VP.
I bought all the gauges listed below fro Diesel performance Parts. The FP by itself was 42.99.
One of the mods recommended by many is the Vulcan big line kit. It moves the Lp off the block(source of heat & vibration) and puts it back by the fuel tank on the frame rail. This also elimates all the banjo bolts, which seem to restict fuel flow. Some of the Cummins dealers still have what is called a camaign pump(LP) for a reasonable price. These seem to do better than the factory issues, perhaps am improved design. I called Cummins recently, they used to be $65, but are now $160, but other dealers may be less. There are other pumps avalable which are mentioned in many threads.
Good luck with the new truck!
2002 seems to be the favored year for the Gen '2 's many problems had been solved or improved, other than the lift pump(A Cummins design).

johnh

call 1 800 955 0476, industrial injection in slc. utah
talk to cody, brett or brady, ask about the vp44
great bunch of guys