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1st Gen. Ram - All TopicsDiscussion for all Dodge Rams prior to 1994. This includes engine, drivetrain and non-drivetrain discussions. Anything prior to 1994 should go in here.
Finally got my IP out of the truck. Invented 17 new cuss words! I pulled the used IP out of my shop Pulled the top off as the previous owner told me it had a fuel pin added to it by the guy he bought his truck from. But probably didn't have a governor spring swap. It's a wonder the durned thing didn't snap in two!
It was probably rolling lots of coal. This IP is a temporary unit. I pulled my THD pin out of the other pump. I didn't get the 3200 spring I installed in it.
Possibly sending my original IP to THD to be rebuilt and "max fueled."
I tell anyone who asks about buying Patches that I want $250,000...they always say it's not worth that and I totally agree with them, but then I inform them that there is really no other truck out there that I want more than my crewcab. The Only other truck I can possibly think of would be one of these...
When I was in PA this weekend, a dude had several of these trucks in his yard, including a rolling chassis or two. Amazing vehicles, although his were in pretty poor condition.
Best thing we saw all day was a 1969 Plymouth GTX B-5 blue with a black vinyl roof. This thing was immaculate, and show quality, just sitting outside a garage in someone's yard. Wife saw it, and I just had to turn around.
Paid for the rebuild to THD. Called Eric and had a good conversation. I was sort of leaning towards a 3800-4000rpm Governor spring. He told me the 3200 will get me to 100mph+ if I wanted to go that fast. Going to the fuelish thread I started.
Stuck the used IP into the vice on my bench. Turned the star wheel flush. Marked it with a Sharpie then did 2 complete turns on it.
Backed the smoke screw all the way up flush.
Turned the fuel screw in all the way and backed it out 1 full turn, locked it in.
The guy that did that magnificent grinding on the factory pin had turned the throttle stop completely flush. No contact at all. Turned it in and went out to where it would contact the throttle lever. As far as I know it is still the factory governor spring.
Installed the THD fuel pin from my original IP that got shipped to THD for rebuilding. I put the factory pin in there. It comes with a new +40hp pin in the cost of the rebuild, and modifications.
I tried to install the IP in the truck. No such luck. When I shut the engine down to remove the old pump I simply pulled it. No TDC or sticking the plastic pin into the gears.
The key way on the cam gear was probably at 8 o'clock. Couldn't see it. I tried to get the IP set to drop in there. I got frustrated and tried to get it to bar it over with the tool *getting shoulder surgery this 6/19I) still had the gear puller in the gear. Thought I would roll it around to the 4:30 position, pin it. Nope. The gear wasn't turning. Everything else was. I rolled the engine before I shut things down for the night with the starter. Silly me! I rolled it to where the intake rocker was opening. NOT WHERE IT NEEDS TO BE. I need to correct that. Somewhere I have a bumper button to attach to the solenoid. It was getting dark I was ready to walk away.
The plastic timing lock pin was globbed up with black RTV. Had to pull it off and dig out the junk to free it up. I am rather dubious after reading NJT's post about his noise if it will work.
Is there a way of repositioning the gear and checking it with a dial indicator? I'm just tossing stuff out there. I really don't want to tear out the timing cover if at all possible.
Working in the driveway sucks.
The input shaft on the IP doesn't have a divot in it for the locking screw does it?
Your are rotating the engine over and the IP gear is NOT moving?
I never go to TDC on my VE pump engines for a pump swap or rebuild. Just make sure the key way goes into the slot on the gear properly and it will be timed correctly, unless the gear was removed and re indexed.
I usually rotate the motor over till the key away is located on the top, in the 12 o'clock position before I remove the IP. I feel it makes it easier to re install and not worry about the key away falling down the gear housing.
There should have been a mark on the pump mounting ear that matches a mark on the timing cover. Assuming the gear hasn't jumped a tooth just rotate the pump shaft to match the keyway in the gear and then rotate the pump to match the marks back up. This assumes you are reinstalling the same pump you took out. Otherwise if you have a pump rebuilt then it should be locked at TDC and that's when you use the pin. You get a barring tool to slowly rotate the engine over until the pin slips in the hole in the gear then install the pump and rotate it towards the engine to take out the backlash then you're in time. I assume you could pay a fee to get your pump locked at TDC to make this easier.
There is a video on YouTube that shows how to R&R the VE pump.
Your are rotating the engine over and the IP gear is NOT moving?
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Correct. I still had the gear puller plate on it. The key way was at 8-ish. Couldn't see it. My helper didn't say anything either. He didn't know. I pulled the puller off. Guessing the gear just popped up and not meshing.
There should have been a mark on the pump mounting ear that matches a mark on the timing cover. Assuming the gear hasn't jumped a tooth just rotate the pump shaft to match the keyway in the gear and then rotate the pump to match the marks back up. This assumes you are reinstalling the same pump you took out. Otherwise if you have a pump rebuilt then it should be locked at TDC and that's when you use the pin. You get a barring tool to slowly rotate the engine over until the pin slips in the hole in the gear then install the pump and rotate it towards the engine to take out the backlash then you're in time. I assume you could pay a fee to get your pump locked at TDC to make this easier.
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I pulled my original pump thinking it would be easy to put the engine and gear on TDC. The pump is used. No idea where it was stopped at. Evidently there is no indentation on the shaft in the pump to put the locking screw into.
Just think of all the experience I will have in a month or 2 when my refurbished pump gets here from THD!!!!
Well if you have the gear indexed correctly then the refurb pump should be set at TDC so timing will be a snap. Getting the gear indexed properly may be difficult. You could try setting close to TDC with the valve on #1 then setting the gear through the holes to the proper position. I would certainly try that first. IIRC the keyway should be at about the 530 position when the engine is at TDC on #1. Being one tooth off would certainly show up.
Have you found the Video in three parts on YouTube? On YouTube search for "5.9L Cummins Injection Pump Replacement Part 1" Parts 2 and 3 should be close by.
Page 9-129 of the FSM shows how to align the IP gear with the cam gear.
We're going to go through the front of the timing cover with a combustion chamber camera on a phone. The backwards C on the cam gear lines up with the E on the IP gear. My friend has the camera doodad.
I am still surprised the gear did not rotate with the motor, when you turned over the motor, with the timing case cover on.
I have never had problems with the IP gear skipping teeth without pulling the cover to gain more wiggle room.
I am still surprised the gear did not rotate with the motor, when you turned over the motor, with the timing case cover on.
I have never had problems with the IP gear skipping teeth without pulling the cover to gain more wiggle room.
I still had the gear puller on the gear. It probably caused the gear to lift "out of mesh." Bolts probably got caught on the timing cover and lifted it up.
06-04-2023, 09:31 PM
I pulled the used IP out of my shop Pulled the top off as the previous owner told me it had a fuel pin added to it by the guy he bought his truck from. But probably didn't have a governor spring swap. It's a wonder the durned thing didn't snap in two!
