jimbo486

what size are they though? i've asked around on cumminsforum and nobody seems to know.

Free89W350

Taken from another site. I think the DDP2 are a little smaller then the stage III.

Chuck @ NewEradiesel.com 740-819-0457

stock 1st gen inj - 6x.009" = .000380" total cross sectional area

2nd gen 215 tips - 4x010 = .000314(17% smaller than stock)

non ic inj - 4x12 = .000452 (19% larger than ic inj)

185's = smaller than stock

190's = smaller than stock

230's = ?

300's = ?

ddp stg III = 50 LPM (liter per minute) 5 hole extrude hone inj

330's - 5x11 = .000474 (20% larger than stock)

2nd gen 370's - 5x12 = .000565 (48% larger than stock)

ddp stg IV = 55 LPM (only 10% larger than stg III's) 5 holes <.013

pods - 4x14 = .000615 (62% larger than stock)

2nd gen 435's - 5x014 = .000769 (twice as large as stock)


custom injectors -

6x13 = .000795

5x15 = .000882

6x14 = .000923

5x16 = .001005

6x15 = .001059

5x17 = .001134 (300% larger than stock)

6x16 = .001206

5x18 = .001272

6x17 = .001360

5x19 = .001416

6x18 = .001526 (400% larger than stock)

5x20 = .001570 (josh ayers custom p-pump inj)

6x20 = .001884 (500% larger than stock)

5x22 = .001900

5x24 = .002261

6x22 = .002280 (600% larger than stock)

Crossy's son

Well my guess is this

DDP2-5x.011
DDP3- 5x.012
DDP4- 5x.013 (fact)

I sent DDP some emails...

jimbo486

well ddp2's are apparently smaller than 370's. at most i'll be paying $480 for 5x.012's from bosch. not much more than the ddp2's and cheaper than the ddp3's which are the same size. i don't have any power upgrades planned for the near future until i get some more money coming in (mostly for a turbo upgrade and larger injectors down the road). and i'm not sure how well the bottom end would hold up. for now, the 5x.012's from bosch will be fine and they'll give me a little extra power over the stockers.

Crossy's son

Welll DDP injectors are extrude honed and not EDM's so DDP can't really tell me the size holes (they don't really know), they say there all 5 hole injectors. the difference between the 3 injectors i LPM. DDp3= 50LPM and DDP4- 55LPM , and the main difference between the 3 injectors is how it hits the piston (spray angle..) .. the DDp4 has a much more tapered spray angle towards the middle of the piston

And he showed me pics of a EDM'd injectors and extrude honed and its amazing how rough the edge is on an EDM injectors, and the spacing between the holes is not even..

its on DDP's website at the bottom of the left column...theres a bunch of pics and stuff.

jimbo486

what exactly do the numbers 185, 190, 230, 300, 330, 370, 435 and so on stand for? is that the volume of fuel each one will flow measured in cc's or what?

jimbo486

the word is in. i'm essentially getting POD's. bec's in whittier looked all over the place to find 9mm nozzles, even talking to bosch directly in germany, and couldn't find any. the only problem with the 7mm's i'm getting is that they don't have any in a 5-hole pattern. so 4x.014's it's gonna to be. they will flow pretty close to or the same as 5x.012's. $58 per nozzle and $23 for labor & reseal of each injector for a total of $493. i'll have them by friday afternoon and should have the truck running by the end of the weekend. i can't wait to hear it come to life again!!

how do you guys think the 4x.014's will perform? if they're essentially the same as POD's, how do POD's perform on non i/c? there's no way for me to know the difference as i've never run POD's.

wannadiesel

They will be better than POD's because the spray angle will be right. Expect about 20-30 HP over your stock injectors.

bgilbert

I would expect little to no increase in HP. NonIC'd injectors will make about the same or a little more HP than 4x14's or POD's.

I don't understand why your shop couldn't find a 5 hole 7mm nozzle. Pretty much the most common 12 valve injector nozzle. Everything from stock Dodge (94+) to marine 370 nozzles.

IMO you should've gotten a set of POD's from a reputable shop. Not a alleged Bosch 'upgrade' nozzle setup.

jimbo486

i haven't heard many good things about POD's in non i/c'd motors. mostly because of the different/wrong spray angle which causes them to haze as most have described. these aren't alleged bosch nozzles, they are genuine bosch nozzles. how could non i/c'd injectors make the same or a little more hp than 4x.014's or POD's if they themselves are only 4x.012's? having the correct spray angle and slightly bigger orifice (thus, more fuel), i would bet on making a bit more power.

Crossy's son

hp ratings. 230 injectors would of came in a 230HP application... 185's would of came in a 185HP application (like a bus)....

crewcabxlt

pods make a little more power than stock non i/c stixs. ive run both. 4x12vs 4x14 however stock non i/c stixs are the best all round 1st gen injector made for good clean power, too bad they only came in 9 mm. pods set to pop at 245 bar work well. pods run cleaner in non/ic motor due to different piston bowl shape. cheap pods (- $200) are a good way to go. 4x14s outflow 5x12,s. ran both as well.

jimbo486

well then too bad 370's won't put me at 370HP those of course are bosch numbers, right?

jimbo486

so crewcab, if i ask the guys to set the pop off pressure of the 4x.014's to 245 (same as stock injectors), they would perform a little better? i may call them and ask them if the pop off pressure will change. they're using my old injector bodies, so maybe it won't?

Edit: called bec's... pop off pressure will change. it'll increase to 260 bar because of the larger holes.

crewcabxlt

actually higher pop pressure can help performance/atomization. its easier on the ve pump to lower it. somthing sounds strange about shops reason for 260 bar,pods come 260 bar so if they are building them w/ your bodies they can set how the want. if the are changing nozzles or body parts they have to reset pop for best results.