Leece Neville alternator conversion.
01-29-2007, 05:22 PM
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For those who aren't TDR members..............here is the info I posted a little further on in my thread.
I hope this works,so here are the intructions and materials,it's a long read so grab a beer and sit back.It wouldn't fit in one post so I made it in two
Upgrading your charging system on your Cummins Ram
I can offer no guarantees or assume any liability for the procedures listed here,so proceed at your own risk.I’m pretty sure though,if you take your time,you shouldn’t have any problems.I spent probably close to 8 hours of trial fitting to get this to work.Now that I know what it takes,I could bolt one on in an hour.For the average person,you may spend 4 or 5 hours getting everything set-up perfect,but it’s not that hard,just time consuming.Plan on most of the day,and make sure you already have everything you need,so you don’t have to run around during the install.You will need a good set of common hand tools,and eiher a good flat file,or a grinder.If you don’t have an impact gun,take the alt,pulley and fan to someone and have it torqued on.Most tire shop have special adapters for the impact guns to prevent over torquing the pulley nut.They will probably do it for next to nothing.Don’t forget to follow basic safety procedures to protect yourself and your ride,and common sense above everything else.Most important are to disconnect BOTH batteries,and wear eye protection.I also must apologize as I am not a professional writer,so these instructions may not be perfect.
The alternator I used was a Leece Neville 110-902.It was 576.00 CDN,so probably $350.00 US.You can also use a 110-555HD.The 110-555HD is a 140 amp version and is available at most truck parts places cheap.The 140 amp version is alos a new updated HD model,with better low speed output,so it is probably the way to go.They are usually around $140.00 US or 240.00 CDN.I think if I had to do it again I would go with the cheaper one,as over $300.00 more for the extra 20 amps isn’t really worth it.You also cannot use some of the larger JB,LB,or JC series alternators,like the 2500 series,as they have a different regulator which will contact the air inlet tube to the turbocharger,and eventually rub through.If in doubt contact me as I have all the datasheets and dimensions as to what will fit.If you want you can check out all the stuff at their website.
http://www.prestolite.com/cgi-bin/pei_alt_series.cgi
You will also need a 8 Groove sepentine pulley.The pulley part # is a generic rebuilder number 1269P.You will have to machine off the stepped end,until the overall thickness is 1.350”.Remove the key stock on the alt shaft before installing pulley and torque the nut.
A new belt (dayco #5080825 or 8PK2095),and a bypass hose (dayco #80400) for AT
You will need two bolts\nuts.A 3/8 X6” NC bolt,and nut,with one flat washer,and a 3/8 NC Lockut,and one 1/2x1.5” NC with two flat washers and a 3/8 NC Locknut.You will also need an extra ½ NC nut.
You will need to round up some bushings which are 3/8” ID and ½” OD.These will go inside the “ears” of the alternator and allow you to use a 3/8” bolt to fit the original lower mounting bracket.You will also need to find a spacer that is just under 2” long with a 3/8” ID as the Leece-Neville alt has 4” ear spacing,and the factory unit was only 2”.Another option,which I would have like to have done,but requires complete removal of the lower alt bracket (which also supports the water inlet,tensioner and A\C),is to drill out the mount to ½” ID hole,so no spacers are required.This requires a lot of labour and did not really seem worth it in the long run.The mounting using the spacer bushings works just fine.
Your will need a piece of 1” X 1/8” flat steel approx 6” long.
You will need a 90 degree 5/8” heater hose elbow,with about 4” of length on one end to reroute the trans heat exchanger line coming out behind the alternator.I don’t think you will need this if you have a manual trans.
You may also need a larger alternator fuse,if you have the smaller 120 amp fuse from the factory,or are using an alternator rated higher than whatever your stock fuse is.
First step is to mount the pulley with the machined side inwards against the alt fan.Torque the nut to the specs listed on the fan.
Next,take your ½” to 3/8” bushings and cut\or grind down the first one to the same thickness as the front lower ear of the alternator.Use a thin film of silicone around it to secure it in the ear of the alternator so it does not fall out upon installation.
Now do the same for the rear lower ear,and secure that bushing as well.Slide your 3/8” long bolt (with a flat washer) through the ears and screw on your locknut,just until it bottoms out.Mark the bolt flush with the end of the nut,and trim it to the exact size,so no bolt hangs out the end of the nut (or it will rub the heater pipe upon installation).Remove the bolt.Place an old 3/8 nut on the bolt past your mark,cut it slowly with a hacksaw,file down the edges,and wind the nut back off to clean up the threads. Check all case bolts and electrical connections on the alternator (except the battery +,and ground stud),and make sure they are tight.A lot of mine were loose.The alternator is now ready to go on the truck.
Remove the battery negative cables first !!!! Other wise you may cause a deadly short.Removing the air inlet hose to the turbo will also help give you more room.Place a rag over the turbo,and use tape to tape it over the rag to the turbo to keep stuff out.If you stuff a rag in it and forget it,well you can see what will happen.We may be grinding some and we don’t want and metal shavings in the turbo.Remove the old alternator,and keep all the old stuff handy,as we will reuse some of it for the new installation.It’s better to completely remove the top bracket to give you more room.Leave the wiring harness clipped to the bracket,as it will stay ther for installation on the new alt.Remove the two heater line clamps above the exhaust manifold so the heater lines are loose.Undo the little bracket for the coolant pipe from the water outlet to the trans heat exchanger (if equipped),and remove the pipe completely.Take off the elbow on the front of the pipe,and replace it with the new hose elbow.You may have to trim one end of the elbow to keep it as close to the block as possible.Leave about 4” on the other end and sline the long end on the pipe,and the short end on the pipe nipple.Remove the heater hose return at the lower water inlet.Take the new alt,and lay it in place,and put in your lower bolt,do not worry about the 2” spacer between the ears as of yet.Take your time as it is a tight fit,and the alt is very heavy.Hand tighten the nut just enough to keep the alternator steady.You will find the alt fan may contact the edge of the belt tensioner.I removed the alt and ground down the raised area on the tensioner just a bit for some added clearance.It probably won’t be necessary once the alternator is rotated up and mounted,but it gives you just a little extra room just in case.Be careful not to take off too much,just enough to flatten it out a bit.I used a die grinder,but a good flat file,and some muscle will do the trick.Once done reinstall the alt and lower bolt,hand tight.You will now find when you go to re-install the heater pipe running down to the water inlet,it will hit the back of the alt.It has a little “s” bend at the bottom already,so all you do is rotate it until it clears,and then rebend the top bend to make it line up with your heater hose,It also helps if you slide it back as far as possible before re-installing the mounting clamps to the manifold.I had to trim about an inch off the heater hose,near the core,as I slid my pipe back about an inch and a half.Take your time and you will get it to fit.Make sure it doesn’t rub anywhere or it will eventually wear through,and leak,due to the vibration of the diesel.If you have a manual without the trans heat exchanger,you should not be able to reconnect everything you disconnect for the heater pipes and double check your fit.If you do have the heat exchanger your will have to move that pipe upwards to clear the alt assy.The new elbow on the front will give you the height you need at the front,and you will have to bend the rear to line up again with the heat exchanger.You may have to run a new piece of 5\8” heater hose at the other end,just a little bit longer.Try not to kink this hose,take your time and bend the pipe little by little,and it will come out right.Once it clears every thing,bolt every thing back up,and double check.Try to reuse the factory spring type hose clamps as they do a much better job and don’t come loose.One trick is to buy a cheap pair of slip joint pliers,and grind a groove in the ends to hold the clamp from slipping out of the jaws.Try and match up the clamp as to where it was positioned before (look at the original impressions in the hose) to prevent leaks.Make sure the clamps do not touch anything (ie:hoses and wiring).I also added a piece of heater hose sliced open and secured with two zip ties around my elbow hose,as it will just contact the back of the alt.This adds some extra protection so the hose won’t wear through.Once that is done,you will have to remove the clamp and reposition it on the bracket that bolts to the exhaust manifold.This is due to the pipe now being higher.I just redrilled a 5/16” hole and bolted it back on.Make sure the heat exchanger pipe does not rub on the heater pipe where they cross over.You may have to bend the bracket up to make it clear.
See next post ....
I hope this works,so here are the intructions and materials,it's a long read so grab a beer and sit back.It wouldn't fit in one post so I made it in two
Upgrading your charging system on your Cummins Ram
I can offer no guarantees or assume any liability for the procedures listed here,so proceed at your own risk.I’m pretty sure though,if you take your time,you shouldn’t have any problems.I spent probably close to 8 hours of trial fitting to get this to work.Now that I know what it takes,I could bolt one on in an hour.For the average person,you may spend 4 or 5 hours getting everything set-up perfect,but it’s not that hard,just time consuming.Plan on most of the day,and make sure you already have everything you need,so you don’t have to run around during the install.You will need a good set of common hand tools,and eiher a good flat file,or a grinder.If you don’t have an impact gun,take the alt,pulley and fan to someone and have it torqued on.Most tire shop have special adapters for the impact guns to prevent over torquing the pulley nut.They will probably do it for next to nothing.Don’t forget to follow basic safety procedures to protect yourself and your ride,and common sense above everything else.Most important are to disconnect BOTH batteries,and wear eye protection.I also must apologize as I am not a professional writer,so these instructions may not be perfect.
The alternator I used was a Leece Neville 110-902.It was 576.00 CDN,so probably $350.00 US.You can also use a 110-555HD.The 110-555HD is a 140 amp version and is available at most truck parts places cheap.The 140 amp version is alos a new updated HD model,with better low speed output,so it is probably the way to go.They are usually around $140.00 US or 240.00 CDN.I think if I had to do it again I would go with the cheaper one,as over $300.00 more for the extra 20 amps isn’t really worth it.You also cannot use some of the larger JB,LB,or JC series alternators,like the 2500 series,as they have a different regulator which will contact the air inlet tube to the turbocharger,and eventually rub through.If in doubt contact me as I have all the datasheets and dimensions as to what will fit.If you want you can check out all the stuff at their website.
http://www.prestolite.com/cgi-bin/pei_alt_series.cgi
You will also need a 8 Groove sepentine pulley.The pulley part # is a generic rebuilder number 1269P.You will have to machine off the stepped end,until the overall thickness is 1.350”.Remove the key stock on the alt shaft before installing pulley and torque the nut.
A new belt (dayco #5080825 or 8PK2095),and a bypass hose (dayco #80400) for AT
You will need two bolts\nuts.A 3/8 X6” NC bolt,and nut,with one flat washer,and a 3/8 NC Lockut,and one 1/2x1.5” NC with two flat washers and a 3/8 NC Locknut.You will also need an extra ½ NC nut.
You will need to round up some bushings which are 3/8” ID and ½” OD.These will go inside the “ears” of the alternator and allow you to use a 3/8” bolt to fit the original lower mounting bracket.You will also need to find a spacer that is just under 2” long with a 3/8” ID as the Leece-Neville alt has 4” ear spacing,and the factory unit was only 2”.Another option,which I would have like to have done,but requires complete removal of the lower alt bracket (which also supports the water inlet,tensioner and A\C),is to drill out the mount to ½” ID hole,so no spacers are required.This requires a lot of labour and did not really seem worth it in the long run.The mounting using the spacer bushings works just fine.
Your will need a piece of 1” X 1/8” flat steel approx 6” long.
You will need a 90 degree 5/8” heater hose elbow,with about 4” of length on one end to reroute the trans heat exchanger line coming out behind the alternator.I don’t think you will need this if you have a manual trans.
You may also need a larger alternator fuse,if you have the smaller 120 amp fuse from the factory,or are using an alternator rated higher than whatever your stock fuse is.
First step is to mount the pulley with the machined side inwards against the alt fan.Torque the nut to the specs listed on the fan.
Next,take your ½” to 3/8” bushings and cut\or grind down the first one to the same thickness as the front lower ear of the alternator.Use a thin film of silicone around it to secure it in the ear of the alternator so it does not fall out upon installation.
Now do the same for the rear lower ear,and secure that bushing as well.Slide your 3/8” long bolt (with a flat washer) through the ears and screw on your locknut,just until it bottoms out.Mark the bolt flush with the end of the nut,and trim it to the exact size,so no bolt hangs out the end of the nut (or it will rub the heater pipe upon installation).Remove the bolt.Place an old 3/8 nut on the bolt past your mark,cut it slowly with a hacksaw,file down the edges,and wind the nut back off to clean up the threads. Check all case bolts and electrical connections on the alternator (except the battery +,and ground stud),and make sure they are tight.A lot of mine were loose.The alternator is now ready to go on the truck.
Remove the battery negative cables first !!!! Other wise you may cause a deadly short.Removing the air inlet hose to the turbo will also help give you more room.Place a rag over the turbo,and use tape to tape it over the rag to the turbo to keep stuff out.If you stuff a rag in it and forget it,well you can see what will happen.We may be grinding some and we don’t want and metal shavings in the turbo.Remove the old alternator,and keep all the old stuff handy,as we will reuse some of it for the new installation.It’s better to completely remove the top bracket to give you more room.Leave the wiring harness clipped to the bracket,as it will stay ther for installation on the new alt.Remove the two heater line clamps above the exhaust manifold so the heater lines are loose.Undo the little bracket for the coolant pipe from the water outlet to the trans heat exchanger (if equipped),and remove the pipe completely.Take off the elbow on the front of the pipe,and replace it with the new hose elbow.You may have to trim one end of the elbow to keep it as close to the block as possible.Leave about 4” on the other end and sline the long end on the pipe,and the short end on the pipe nipple.Remove the heater hose return at the lower water inlet.Take the new alt,and lay it in place,and put in your lower bolt,do not worry about the 2” spacer between the ears as of yet.Take your time as it is a tight fit,and the alt is very heavy.Hand tighten the nut just enough to keep the alternator steady.You will find the alt fan may contact the edge of the belt tensioner.I removed the alt and ground down the raised area on the tensioner just a bit for some added clearance.It probably won’t be necessary once the alternator is rotated up and mounted,but it gives you just a little extra room just in case.Be careful not to take off too much,just enough to flatten it out a bit.I used a die grinder,but a good flat file,and some muscle will do the trick.Once done reinstall the alt and lower bolt,hand tight.You will now find when you go to re-install the heater pipe running down to the water inlet,it will hit the back of the alt.It has a little “s” bend at the bottom already,so all you do is rotate it until it clears,and then rebend the top bend to make it line up with your heater hose,It also helps if you slide it back as far as possible before re-installing the mounting clamps to the manifold.I had to trim about an inch off the heater hose,near the core,as I slid my pipe back about an inch and a half.Take your time and you will get it to fit.Make sure it doesn’t rub anywhere or it will eventually wear through,and leak,due to the vibration of the diesel.If you have a manual without the trans heat exchanger,you should not be able to reconnect everything you disconnect for the heater pipes and double check your fit.If you do have the heat exchanger your will have to move that pipe upwards to clear the alt assy.The new elbow on the front will give you the height you need at the front,and you will have to bend the rear to line up again with the heat exchanger.You may have to run a new piece of 5\8” heater hose at the other end,just a little bit longer.Try not to kink this hose,take your time and bend the pipe little by little,and it will come out right.Once it clears every thing,bolt every thing back up,and double check.Try to reuse the factory spring type hose clamps as they do a much better job and don’t come loose.One trick is to buy a cheap pair of slip joint pliers,and grind a groove in the ends to hold the clamp from slipping out of the jaws.Try and match up the clamp as to where it was positioned before (look at the original impressions in the hose) to prevent leaks.Make sure the clamps do not touch anything (ie:hoses and wiring).I also added a piece of heater hose sliced open and secured with two zip ties around my elbow hose,as it will just contact the back of the alt.This adds some extra protection so the hose won’t wear through.Once that is done,you will have to remove the clamp and reposition it on the bracket that bolts to the exhaust manifold.This is due to the pipe now being higher.I just redrilled a 5/16” hole and bolted it back on.Make sure the heat exchanger pipe does not rub on the heater pipe where they cross over.You may have to bend the bracket up to make it clear.
See next post ....
01-29-2007, 05:23 PM
#18
(And korrect speeling is alle a consperacie of da diksionary companees anywaes. If Milton didn't haf to spel write, why do I?)
01-29-2007, 05:24 PM
#19
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Here is the rest of it .......
Now you can remove your lower bolt and install the 2” spacer,and tighten up the bottom bolt,just enough to hold up the alt.Bolt the upper bracket in place and make two links from your piece of 1” flat stock (approx 2-3” long) with a ½” hole on one end and a 10MM hole on the other.You should be able to rotate the alt up until it about ¼” away from the water outlet,and then measure the distance for your links.You can now bolt these two links (with a ½” nut as a spacer) using the original alt bolt to the original alt bracket,and use a ½” bolt to bolt them to the new alt.Use a nut on the back side to hold the rear link.Due to the casting ridge on my new alt I had to just clearance the top ear of the alt to get the bolt through the top bracket.Also check the clearance to the alt fan and alt bracket near where it bolts to the water outlet,I had to grind it down,just to be safe.Once it’s all bolted on,torque all the bolts.Because the upper ear of the alternator is threaded,you will have to tighten the bolt first,then tighten the nut on the back,or you’ll damage it.Now double check to make sure nothing is rubbing hitting or binding,and spin the alt to make sure the fan clears everything.If not,spend some time and do it right,other wise it will come back to haunt you later.
You can now install a longer belt,part #5080825 or 8PK2095.Any jobber will be able to cross theses numbers to get you a belt.I used a Dayco ploy-cog,and no squeaks or shut down chirp as of yet.I will probably track down a Goodyear Gatorback belt and keep this one as my spare.Make sure you get the exact belt,otherwise it will slip if too big or damage bearings if too small.It can difficult to get on,take your time.Watch the bottom of the crank pulley,it has to slide up past the oil pan first,or you’ll never get it on.
Lastly,you will need to make your electrical connections to the rear of the alt.I used the factory wiring,and just cut the two small wires,and tape them to the harness.I also ground off the two small tabs as well.Then you can use the large molded connector,and mount the ground and positive wires.Remember the positive is the long wire,and the ground is the little tab on the side on the moulded assy.I had to enlarge my postive ring to 5/16” so it would go over the stud.Drill slowly and hold the connector tightly with a pair of vise grips,or it will spin around and get damaged.You will have to stretch the positive to get it on,but it will reach.Tighten your nuts,and make sure the little plastic locating tab is holding the harness to the top of the alt bracket.If not use a zip tie.Now again,double check everything,and she is ready to fire up.
After you get it running you may notice a much higher reading on the voltmeter as the regulator is fixed at 14.5 volts,unlike most alts which are variable.The regulator will turn on and off to prevent overcharging.This alternator has no "idiot" light,but you will be able to see on the voltmeter if it stops charging.Now is the time to upgrade your alt fuse to match your output,so it won’t blow.One thing to note is these things can put out way more than the rated capacity,so go a little higher than the alt rating.My alt,when we bench tested it,put out 195 amps at full load.You will probably never see this on the truck,but a 10-20 amp safety margin should do it.If you are using a 140 amp alt,use a 150-160 amp fuse.Make sure it is a slo-blow type or voltage spikes will blow it quickly.I used an import style flat metal fuse that is slo-blow rated for 180 amps,and it is holding up.I got it from a local jobber.It was for a VW Passat,I think.I could not find a factory type over 140 amps.You may also want to take it to a generator shop and have it load tested to make sure everything is working correctly.Good luck.If you need anymore info you can contact me below.
Chris W. Barrett (aka Bigramguy)
BTW....I don't want to patent anything,I'm actually glad someone got some good use out of the info.I just got a little ticked when he made it sound like he came up with this idea himself.
Now you can remove your lower bolt and install the 2” spacer,and tighten up the bottom bolt,just enough to hold up the alt.Bolt the upper bracket in place and make two links from your piece of 1” flat stock (approx 2-3” long) with a ½” hole on one end and a 10MM hole on the other.You should be able to rotate the alt up until it about ¼” away from the water outlet,and then measure the distance for your links.You can now bolt these two links (with a ½” nut as a spacer) using the original alt bolt to the original alt bracket,and use a ½” bolt to bolt them to the new alt.Use a nut on the back side to hold the rear link.Due to the casting ridge on my new alt I had to just clearance the top ear of the alt to get the bolt through the top bracket.Also check the clearance to the alt fan and alt bracket near where it bolts to the water outlet,I had to grind it down,just to be safe.Once it’s all bolted on,torque all the bolts.Because the upper ear of the alternator is threaded,you will have to tighten the bolt first,then tighten the nut on the back,or you’ll damage it.Now double check to make sure nothing is rubbing hitting or binding,and spin the alt to make sure the fan clears everything.If not,spend some time and do it right,other wise it will come back to haunt you later.
You can now install a longer belt,part #5080825 or 8PK2095.Any jobber will be able to cross theses numbers to get you a belt.I used a Dayco ploy-cog,and no squeaks or shut down chirp as of yet.I will probably track down a Goodyear Gatorback belt and keep this one as my spare.Make sure you get the exact belt,otherwise it will slip if too big or damage bearings if too small.It can difficult to get on,take your time.Watch the bottom of the crank pulley,it has to slide up past the oil pan first,or you’ll never get it on.
Lastly,you will need to make your electrical connections to the rear of the alt.I used the factory wiring,and just cut the two small wires,and tape them to the harness.I also ground off the two small tabs as well.Then you can use the large molded connector,and mount the ground and positive wires.Remember the positive is the long wire,and the ground is the little tab on the side on the moulded assy.I had to enlarge my postive ring to 5/16” so it would go over the stud.Drill slowly and hold the connector tightly with a pair of vise grips,or it will spin around and get damaged.You will have to stretch the positive to get it on,but it will reach.Tighten your nuts,and make sure the little plastic locating tab is holding the harness to the top of the alt bracket.If not use a zip tie.Now again,double check everything,and she is ready to fire up.
After you get it running you may notice a much higher reading on the voltmeter as the regulator is fixed at 14.5 volts,unlike most alts which are variable.The regulator will turn on and off to prevent overcharging.This alternator has no "idiot" light,but you will be able to see on the voltmeter if it stops charging.Now is the time to upgrade your alt fuse to match your output,so it won’t blow.One thing to note is these things can put out way more than the rated capacity,so go a little higher than the alt rating.My alt,when we bench tested it,put out 195 amps at full load.You will probably never see this on the truck,but a 10-20 amp safety margin should do it.If you are using a 140 amp alt,use a 150-160 amp fuse.Make sure it is a slo-blow type or voltage spikes will blow it quickly.I used an import style flat metal fuse that is slo-blow rated for 180 amps,and it is holding up.I got it from a local jobber.It was for a VW Passat,I think.I could not find a factory type over 140 amps.You may also want to take it to a generator shop and have it load tested to make sure everything is working correctly.Good luck.If you need anymore info you can contact me below.
Chris W. Barrett (aka Bigramguy)
BTW....I don't want to patent anything,I'm actually glad someone got some good use out of the info.I just got a little ticked when he made it sound like he came up with this idea himself.
01-29-2007, 07:18 PM
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