greenrig

hey folks. this site rocks. been doing tons of reading but never had to ask questions untill now. took my stock 90' (except for banks intercooler) 4x4 with 220k to baja for some light offroad mainly to get to remote surf spots. super fun trip untill my fuel pressure guage dropped and the oil light came on. as soon as i got out of the truck i could smell hot oil and noticed it was covering everthing under the chassis. check the dip stick and it reads full...full of 100% diesel!! my wife and i are in central baja 4hrs into the dessert with noone insight and no businesses for hundreds of miles. except for the mechanico two mexican shacks down the road! how lucky! i dont really speak spanish or he english so it was fun trying to communicate. he drained the diesel from where the oil should be and it was all diesel, filled me up with oil and sent me on my way. the drama continues.. that got us out of the desert and to the next town. same thing-flush diesel, fill oil. this mechanico claims fuel pump but part is in san diego and it will take days to come so we continue on to san diego. NOW THE DEALERSHIP DRAMA! they think the diesel is leaking into the crankcase through a bad injector so they replace all six with cummins remanufactured stock injctors. did i tell that my wife and i had to fly home? well i flew back from santa cruz (1hr flight or 8 driving) to get my 'fixed' truck but replacing the injectors did not fix the problem because by the time i got to san clemente (2 hrs north ) i had no oil and a crank case full of diesel. so i drove it back to the dealer and they admit they do not know what it is and will research the cause. did i tell you i flew home again with no truck? ha! cummins bros, what is this?

things i may have done wrong: ran a couple of tanks of 100% b99 biodiesel before the trip but switched to the to the $1.90 gallon diesel in mexico.(i guess they dont tax the hell out of it.)
put on a new fuel filter myself before the trip. should be simple right? but maybe i scewed that up.

i forgot to say all the oil leaking out was coming from the overflow not any gaskets. and no coolant in the oil.

thanks!

wannadiesel

Two possible problems: bad lift pump (cheap and easy) or a blown injection pump front seal (expensive and not so easy). Could be either one, but I'm betting on the pump seal.

greenrig

thanks wannnadiesel

you say pump seal. you mean IP seal or LP seal. and what is reasonable reasonable repair charge or labor in hours, including parts if it was the IP seal. -just arming myself with defense when the dealership trys to make up for the $1500 they already charged me for replacing 6 injectors plus new oil and filter THAT DID NOT FIX THE PROBLEM ! i hope they make it right!

another concern is i drove with only diesel in the crankcase for hundreds of miles at low speeds and when not knowing about the problem: high speeds. is diesel a good enough lube to not cause damage. i had my eye on the temp gauge and it never got hot.

jogl

He meant the seal on the injection pump.

To change the seal on the IP is a few dollars in parts and (I'm guessing, haven't done a VE yet) maybe 2 to 4 hrs labour. Of course, they will want to rebuild the entire IP which would be $1000ish, but is probably not necessary.

If it were me, in a desperately hopeful move, I would change the lift pump first to be sure that that is not the problem. On our tractors I'm 2 for 3 it was the LP. LP is a couple hundred dollars (maybe less) and less than an hours labour.

Only time will tell on running with diesel for engine lube. When the fuel leak is found and repaired cross your fingers and keep your eye on the oil pressure gauge.

Good Day,
JP.

Hammered Scout

From what I've read on this site you are describing the exact symtoms of a bad lift pump diaphram. When it goes bad fuel goes directly into the crankscase. You can bypass the stock liftpump and put in an electric pump(6-8psi) el cheapo should work. Hope this works. And when the dealer tries to rip you off tell him " No Chinges"

timb

I know that when my lift pump went south the priming lever on the pump did not have preasure on it when you tried to use it. Meaning when you pumped the lever, it was just loose. I guess you could try pumping the primer and see if it feels like it is pumping anything. I would be willing to bet that you did no damage at all to the engine. There was probably still enough engine oil mixed with the diesel to lubricate the internals.

Hammered Scout

The pumping primer will only work when it's on the lobe. When you crank the motor it will eventually get on that lobe and allow you to pump otherwise it will feel loose with no resistense.

mhuppertz

If it is the lift pump, get a piston pump to replace it. There is a sticky on this. They show up frequently on Ebay.

92DuallyCTD

My vote is lift pump first also...since you mentioned the piston pump replacement, would the later model pump fit the original location/mount/fuel lines as a direct bolt-in? Or at least minimal mods? Anyone actually done this yet and relate their experience? Thanks! And good luck to you greenrig, hope you get going soon. :-)

Micaiahfied

92duallyctd, the later model LP would fit, hoever the pumps designed for the second gens run too high of a fuel pressure for the VE to handle. I believe you can buy a rebuild kit if you had a 2nd gen pump lying around but you wouldn't want to run it as is.

90firstgen

Lift pumps are far cheaper than that. Definately replace it first. But it sounds like the VE seal is bad just because its pumping a LOT of fuel. I wouldn't think the lift pump would pump very well with a massively torn diaphram. Correct me if I'm wrong though

Edit: Lift pump would NOT pump very well with a massively torn diaphram

mhuppertz

Please refer to this sticky brought to you by BC847 and Dave:
https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...ad.php?t=93722

wannadiesel

My thoughts exactly.

The seal can be replaced without rebuilding the pump, but many shops will only deal with the pump as a unit.

Hopefully since you were running slow things are OK inside the engine. Like jogl said, if the oil pressure is good, cross your fingers and drive it. If the oil pressure is low but it's not knocking you may be able to get by with just rolling in new bearings. I'm more concerned about the pistons than the bearings, though.

greenrig

thank you all

it is so difficult trying to make decisions about your truck when it is a plane ride away. the dealership doesnt want to do the work on either the LP or IP, which they now agree is the problem, due to a lack of proper tools!? . for the full refund they want to put my original injectors back in. i'm pretty confident my original injectors were fine. i would love to drive it 8 hours and get it the hell out of there but i fear it to be too dangerous. like flamable danger. my mpg gallon is cut in half when driving with the leak and all the oil is basically washed out of the crankcase. that is A LOT of fuel coming in from somewhere.

SHOULD I :
- gamble and just drive it the 400 plus miles as is?
if i attached a hose to the overflow and to a collection container placed in the bed of the truck maybe it would be much safer than letting it spew EVERYwhere.

-try to find someone in san diego who will work on it and then drive it home? which i believe to be ideal but i dont know SD or SD mechanics.

-or tow it the 300 miles? doesnt Uhaul rent a truck and trailer that would do the job?

please any GOOD recommendations of cummins mechanics in the san diego area that can do the job would be helpful.

ontos

The diapram lift pump from Cummins is $100. You can get and may want a cheaper one( if you are going to go to some other pump deal later) from auto parts places. It is a pretty simple job to change, did one yesterday in 15 min. The dealer you are talking to would be able to replace the diaphram pump, no special tools required, they must be talking about the injector pump needing special tools.
I think a bad injector pump seal would be a slower leak, but may be wrong. If it is a slow leak you could drive it home even if you had to change oil.