oliver foster

Exactly. I plan on cutting just under the inner fender, then weld up a lower edge to the outer fender so it doesn't loose its structure and be left floppy.

I assume you also added a bit of a lifted spring on the front for those 37s to fit. How much lift spring did you add?
I am trying to keep my truck as low as possible and still fit at least 35s to help with the 4.10 gearing my truck has.

KRB

So Oliver, the reason for moving the axle forward was to reduce height? I scrolled back through the thread (quickly) but couldn't find the "why".

oliver foster

The truck has 4.10 gears, which when coupled with the low revving Cummins motor, I feel works best for loaded dump trucks [or similarly used work only trucks] or when used on more of a driver style truck with 35 or even better 37 tires.
I have 37s on my white '85 crew cab and to make them fit well, I have a 6 inch lift. Plus I also had to radius cut then welded the lip back on the front fenders, both in front and behind the wheel for clearance. This involved re-shaping the inner wheel well too.

I don't want this truck to have a big lift, but still want at least 35s. This means cutting the fenders. The least "invasive" way to do that would be trimming the leading edge of my front fender, also giving me a better approach angle. Moving the axle forward should give me the needed clearance on the back side of the front wheel well, so I will not have to trim that. Trimming the rear of the front fender's wheel well cleanly, then reshaping everything takes a bunch of work to have it look decent. The radius of the opening of the factory 1st gen fenders is pretty small.

Some of the other bonuses to the axle moving forward, are better front driveshaft angles which is always important on even mildly lifted rigs.
To a much smaller degree, it also shifts a little more weight to the rear of the truck. Picture old funny cars.

It also got me to relocate my steering box to the the stronger 2wd location, ditching the funny 4x4 steer gear plate that always cracks, and try out cross-over steering for the first time. That should make for crisper steering input without all that stuff twisting and distorting.

OR... I could have saved myself a TON of work and just installed a set of 3.54 geared axles - which I have plenty of. But come on, how fun would that have been??

Ryan Stuchly

I completely agree with Your logic and going 35s+ on a 4.10 truck.

yessir I am using a 4” leaf up front and I added OFFROAD designs zero rate to the pack (to gain the 1.5” stretch) so that puts me at 5” or so.
Where can I find more on your 85 crew?
is there a link on it or anything?

thank you

oliver foster

I never really made a thread about my white '85 crew cab.
I bought that truck long before I started hanging out here. Man it must be about 17 years since I lifted and cut out those wheel wells.
It was also the first Cummins conversion project I did.
You can see a small picture of that truck in my avatar picture.



Back to this club cab 2wd to 4x4 swap project.
I am trying to get away with just a 1 inch Skyjacker lift, at least that is what it looks like. I ended up with the leaf springs used, but never installed and my friend can not exactly remember what he ordered. Either a 1 or 2 inch leveling kit was what he ordered from Skyjacker.

I am using FSS [Far From Stock] 1/4 thick axle relocation block to move the axle forward exactly 1 inch. So I bet I have less than 2 inches of lift. I also added 1/2 longer shackles on the rear of the front spring. Which with the axle moved forward should be plenty for full travel movement and 35s...at least that is what I tell myself.

I did used Offroad Design's cross over steering kit. I am assuming you are using crossover too. Moving the axle makes crossover steering start to look like the best option.

I did nothing to the rear suspension. Depending on how it sits when it is all done, might easily be how it stays.

oliver foster

I did locate one good picture of it on the "What did you do to your 1st gen today" thread.
On post #8010 is a good picture of my white crew cab taken last spring while doing some back road cruising.

nonrev

Here ya go

oliver foster

Well since it is about -20F up here in VT and I had some free time last night I worked out in the shop on this project after dinner and into the night.
It may not sound very exciting, but spinning a heavy 20 foot long truck 180* in a PACKED 36X36 area takes some beer engineering, also know around here as beer-gineering. I needed to spin the 93 truck around 180* degrees so when the bed is pulled off the donor truck and in the air on the shop lift, I can push the 4x4 truck under the bed and lower it down with the tailgate facing the...well the rear tailgate area.

Several straps, a winch, my come-a-long and 4 rolling dollies where all used. One Harbor Freight dolly spit one of the 4 wheels out with the weight of the Cummins motor over it, before it was all done. The dogs all watched me with a puzzled look on their faces as I pushed and pulled the non running truck around in the small space. With the truck finally facing the same direction now as the donor truck / bed on the lift, I could move on to wrenching.

I had already cleanly removed as much of the rear wire harness as I could with the fuel tank still in place. It was time to drop the almost full fuel tank. Out came the motorcycle floor jack and a standard floor jack to lower the tank to the ground after I got the straps off. After struggling with removing the tank, which has quite a bit less room to work on with a lower 2wd truck than the 4x4 Dodges I usually work on, I called it a night and hit the shower.

I am getting closer to the next stage, RE-assembly.

nonrev

Hmmm, beer-gineering I have done some of my finest and have occasionally simply over beer-gineneerred several projects, not sure of the space you had but wouldn't it have been easier to spin the box?

KRB

Spin the box? Now THAT is under-beergineering! But, a good question...

Is that N'or-eastern headed your way? If so, sounds like more shop time ahead.

oliver foster

I thought about pulling the box, putting it down on some dollies and spinning the box around... then lifting it back in the air using the shop lift. The problem would be once the bed is in the air and I roll the frame with the cab bolted to it, under the bed, the front edge of the cab, by the windshield will hit the shop lift arms holding up the bed.
This leaves me with backing the rear of the frame only under the bed and keeping the cab clear of the low hanging bed.

Like I said, there was some beer-gineering to solve the Mopar puzzle with the least work. If I had a couple of buddies here we could have just picked the bed up and placed it on the frame, but between timing, Covid, ETC, I needed to solve it in a way I could do alone.

KRB,
Yes I hope to get a little more time to start putting the next pieces of the puzzle back together while the weather is cold outside. The forecast is for 6-10 inches of snow mid week as well.

oliver foster

Well I got to push around several non running Dodge trucks in the shop again today.
The bed was pulled from the 2wd frame and is in the air on the shop lift with the 4x4 frame lined up to drop it on. I will next install the rear wire harness and fuel tank on the 4x4 frame before dropping on the "new" bed.

KRB

Speaking of frames and fuel tanks. From all the trucks you've dealt with, disassembled, assembled or parted out, about what percentage had fuel tank frame rot and to what extent?
I assume due to your locale there is the salt/brine issue but you get trucks from elsewhere too right? Any observations?

I don't mud my truck but I do drive muddy farm roads and KY must get paid to salt & brine the roads here although I only drive in those conditions when I absolutely have to. I try to hit that area with my pressure washer when I can but I occasionally have nightmares and wake up in a cold sweat. Part of me is afraid to look...

oliver foster

KRB, good question. The local 1st and 2nd gen trucks from the Maine, NH, NY, VT, MA, RI, CT and PA area are usually bordering on needing of the area behind the fuel tank to be cut out and have a section welding back in to really save them. Not only does the fuel tank make washing the dirt, dust and in our area salt residue out from behind it. It also makes condensation all summer long as the up to 35 gallons of diesel in the tank stays cold from the night temps, then during the warm humid day it soaks that lower, salty, dirt cover frame rail, allowing the rust to really bloom.

The 1st gens have a lower plastic anti rub piece that slides over the lower frame edge to prevent chafing of the tank, which also really helps the rust take over.

On my current project, I am wondering how I can modify that plastic piece so it still does its job of keeping the tank safe without trapping the dirt, ETC right on the lower, outer lip of the frame. This is what is doing the worst damage to the metal.
Thoughts I have for it....Remove it all together and do nothing else, but check the tank periodically for wear....Cut it into small pieces so it still provides some anti wear, but you might be able to wash behind it and also allow for some air circulation....cut small notches on the outside edge, of it every few inches, but still keep it whole... maybe even pad out the tank straps to push the tank away from the frame rail an extra 1/8 inch and ditch the plastic strip?

Any thoughts guys?

I still see frame damage to the other rigs I have from other drier areas, but not nearly to the extent of the New England stuff.

I personally like working on the trucks that are not from around here. I would say almost 100% of the New England 1st gen trucks that are driven year around and have been here for 1 year or more have some rust starting behind the fuel tank.
That is why I store all the 1st gens and a couple of the 2nd gens for the winter.

KRB

I'd say ..Cut it into small pieces so it still provides some anti wear, but you might be able to wash behind it and also allow for some air circulation.. And/or pad out the tank straps to push the tank away from the frame rail an extra 1/8 inch and ditch the plastic strip. You're replacing the straps anyway, if I remember correctly, right?

Or I guess if you really wanted to beergineer it, mount a capped tube to the upper frame rail with holes (jets) and a hose fitting on the end. Hook it up every now & then and flush things out...